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rokon2813

I know there are pullers here....

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rokon2813
I may try tractor pulling this weekend. I have the opportunity to run my 64 Landlord in exhibition and a nephews $6000 Cub Cadet in competition. Any last minute tips or hints on either one?

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HubbardRA
Dan, I could write a book on the subject, especially in the areas of setting up the tractors. Assuming that you are only driving, I would say to make sure that there is sufficient weight on the nose of the tractor to prevent the front wheels from lifting off the ground. This is especially true if you don't have a set of "wheelie bars" on the tractor, but a good idea any time. Maximum rear tire force is when front tires are producing no force on the ground but are still lightly in contact. As the front comes up the hitch goes down and the chain angle changes and lowers the pull down force of the chain losing traction. Also if the tractor starts to go to one side lean in the direction it is going. This causes more traction on that rear wheel and will turn the tractor back in the direction that you want to go. Do not over use this correction since the shortest distance to the end is a straight line, so you want to correct only enough to stay on the track. Driving back to the middle makes you go farther but actually shortens the measured distance that you pulled since you are driving in an arc. Be straight, smooth, and stay safe. Have Fun!

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rokon2813
Thanks Rod, sound like good tips. As far as the Cub is concerned driving is all I am doing. The owners will be there to set all the weights and decide which gear for that track. Since that tractor was points leader a couple years in a row I'm not much worried about it as long as I dont screw up. The Landlord is another story. It's mine and I dont want to hurt it but I would like to make a decent showing with an "ugly old tractor" without too many major mods. I know about the setscrews on the rear hub to make it "posi". I have that set for the stuff I do around the house with it. It has 23 x 8.50 x 12 ag tires on it with wheel weights so I think that will work ok. Since it is belt drive I'm considering a second spring on the clutch pulley for a little extra tension. Would that be ok? And also if I do the spring thing would the old Briggs have enough to run in third gear or should I pull in second? I'm not all all concerned with wheel speed just how far down the track I can get it to go. Also if I have to how do I put a "quickie" emergency kill switch on cheap and easy?

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HubbardRA
We run a 61 Wards which is the same as a 700. I have a 14Hp kohler on it with 23x10.5x12 ag tires. We run in second gear with the stock pulleys. If you have the original engine, you may run out of engine in second gear depending on the weight class. We run at 900 lb -tractor with driver. 4000 rpm max governor speed. 13 inch hitch height. At the last pull my son got 2nd place, but was having trouble keeping the front end down which let the wheelie bars drive into the ground pretty hard causing a loss of traction. We only had 65 lb hanging on a rack from the front axle of the tractor. For a kill switch, I buy a receptacle made to snap into a flat panel for a 110 volt appliance cord and put this into a mounting bracket. You can also just clamp the female end of an extension cord onto the chassis. I then take an old cord and cut it off leaving only the plug (male end) and about 3 inches of wire. Separate the wires for a couple of inches, remove some insulation, twist them together and then solder. Tape it up to prevent shorting. I also put a ring through this loop for the hook to snap into. Run your ignition wire to the recptacle and back. The plug completes the circuit when inserted. This if for a Kohler battery ignition. For a magneto system you can use phono headphone plug. They have n internal switch that is used to disconnect the speakers when the headphone plug is inserted. Wire this cicuit from the kill wire through this switch to ground. When the plug is inserted the switch will be open, when it is pulled out the switch will close and ground out the ignition. I also use an eyebolt and a small plastic cable tie to attach the loop to the chassis and prevent the weight of the safety cable from pulling out the connector. The cable tie will break if the cable pulls hard.

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MikeES
Dan, you can also buy the safety switch at any RV or trailer place. Most new trailers with electric brakes come with a safety switch. My son and I have been pulling for 6 years, and the trick with the AC/SIM is center weight. We rarely put any weight on the front or back. You will also want your back tires firm (no squash). So far this year our 718 (Ace) has taken 2-1st and 2-2nds out of 4 hooks in the 800# class. In the 1000# class it has nothing less than a 4th. Our 917 (Deuce) has nothing less than a 4th out of 8 hooks.

Good Luck this weekend!

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HubbardRA
Interesting Mike, I prefer front and rear with no center weight. Center weight is much harder to balance when you are pulling on many different tracks. It is fine when you run the same track constantly. Take a littoff the back and move it to the front or vice versa and it makes quite a difference.

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MikeES
Rod, as you can on the tractors our center weight bracket is low and as far back as we can get it (without the weights hitting the tires or ground). Also as you can see we don't use the extenable front weight bracket as most pullers use. My theory is that I keep all the weight close to the center of gravity and tractor pivot point. The weight way out front, I think, creates the 'dumbell' effect (all weight on the ends and non in the middle). In the real world we never pull the same track twice in a season, we will pull at least 14 events this year, blacktop, dirt, and clay tracks (that is 56 hooks with both tractors). We never have a problem with going out of bounds, our tractors go straight down the track, even with the front wheels in the air (which is not good, but rare). The tractors with the extended out front weight and back weight seem to always take the long route down the track. Dan, if your Landlord has a good strong 10hp, and your are weighted 900lbs. or less, 2nd gear will work great. If your weight is more, you will need 1st gear. Most pulls you are allowed to stop within the first 40ft and reweight and start over. If the front end comes up easy on start, stop and reweight, likewise if you spin easy and the front end did not get light, put more back weight on. Most tracks you will finish as you started. Dan, one other suggestion, you may want to wear dark sunglasses when you are driving the Cub so no one will recognize you.:D

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rokon2813
got the dark glasses covered...gonna super glue the dark shield shut on the helmet. As far as the weights, the Landlord is only running exhibition or straight "Off The Lawn" so it has no weights or weight bars other than my wheel weights and I dont think it will be weighed in. This site says shipping weight on a Landlord is 680 lbs. It does not say that includes the deck so I assume it does not. So plus my 80 lb weights (40 on each wheel) and 185 lbs on the seat it should be 945 lbs. Also the Landlord is a 9 hp not 10. This one is bored 30 over but its tired too. Basically when it pulls it also "fogs for skeeteers" [:0], so I may run first gear then though I think it will pull in second. I'll have to see what the other tractors are doing I guess. Its all for fun anyway just to say I've done it.

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HubbardRA
Mike, I have always run a similar setup to you. Hang on rack in front, hangon rack on rear, and belly bar close to wheels. You want the weights on the belly bar to be as close to ehe end as you can get them. This produces the most inertia and slows down the turning rate of the machine. I use the front rear bars to adjust traction and front end lift. Also keep in mind that I have spent most of my time running homebuilt motorcycle engine tractors. These are a lot more touchy than a good solid stock machine. 1100lb with 85+ horsepower under the hood can get crazy in a heartbeat. I had mine set up for maximum effect from movement of driver's body. That is how you steered it during a pull. Had a straight rear axle, and it pulled best with front wheels about an inch off the ground. Had to do some work on front axle pivot to make both wheels lift together. I could always drive straight down the track, but I let several friends try it and none ever went more than about 30 feet without going out of bounds. That machine had to be manhandled by throwing your body weight around. Simplicities and AC stock machines with limited slip, tend to be very stable and are not as sensitive to the driver. There are lots of tricks and techniques we could talk about, but that would take a book.

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MikeES
Rod, yes it would take a book. For everyone reading this thread, tractor pulling is fun sport and great for your "tractor" kid. My son started when he was 6, he is now 12.

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rokon2813
Well guys I tried it. I ended up not running the Cub but one of the boys took a first with it in Stock Altered Heavy class (1100 lbs) The club did not want to run an exhibition so they put my Landlord in competition. At the last minute I decided to put wheelie bars on. Other than that it was 100% stock. Since it wasnt set up for weights or anything they did not make me "weigh in" but put it in 2 classes; Stock Altered Light (1000 lbs) and Stock Altered Heavy (1100 lbs). Being the tractor was stock the hitch was only 5 or 6 inches off the ground in the light class it never even moved the sled. Judges didnt expect to see me again. Between classes I figured out how to raise the hitch using some extra bolts from a club member and the existing holes above the hitch on the rear lift group. The rules allow a max of 13 inch height and I got it rigged to 12 and 3/4 as they were calling my name for the heavy class. They were surprised when I hooked to try again still with no weights. The only mistake I made this time was not listening to you guys and pulling in first gear. I ran second. They dont do rehooks under 40 feet here. There are also NO Simplicities or Allis Chalmers in this club and No Briggs engines. Everyone, including me were impressed, when that 39 year old Simplicity with the worn out 9 hp Briggs stood on the wheelie bars and pulled the 6000 lb sled 27 feet. My "tiny" 23 x 8.50 x 12 ag tires never broke traction. The front tires were still 18 inches off the ground when the engine quit. They say belt drive slips too much to pull with. After that we decided to weigh it. In the 1100 lb class my old Simp weighed in at a whopping 876 lbs with me on it. Everyone who had laughed when I backed up to the sled the second time suddenly had puzzled frowns. Needless to say,I'm hooked. Next spring there will be a painted, restored, weighted and Briggs powered Simplicity for the club to try to beat.

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HubbardRA
Good job Dan! Green Gates belts and a heavy clutch spring. Make yourself some weight bars. Put on an equal engine and equal tires and I guarantee they will not laugh at the Simplicity any more.

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HubbardRA
Dan, Here are a couple of pictures of our 61 Wards puller. In the pictures there is a snow plow mounted on the tractor and the wheelie bars have been removed. Let me know what you think.

Front wheels are original. Grille was fabricated, since the original was badly torn. [img]/club2/attach/HubbardRA/P000268.jpg[/img] The diff is a late model limited slip unit, and the driveshaft has flex plates instead of the original rattle joints. I widened the rear wheels to accommodate the larger tires. If you look carefully, you will notice that the center of the wheel is facing inward and the widening was done on what is normally the inside of the wheel. As can be seen below, this gives the tractor a very narrow stance for these large tires. The rear seat mount was also raised 1 1/2 inches to clear the tires.

I hope you like my "pride and joy". I sure have had fun with it over the years. Hope you can get as much enjoyment out of pulling as I have.

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rokon2813
Very nice ride. We will see how mine turns out and I will try to post some before and after pictures. I probably wont do the restore and paint till this winter but it depends how fast I find an Engine. Due to lack of funds I'm also going for the cheapest puller in the club too! LoL My brother in law is giving me a set of tires if I can get them under there. We tried to put them on at the pull but they wouldnt go under the fenders. 26 x 12 x 12 Ag tires. The biggest the club allows. So far I've got $100 in the tractor and the tires are free so the price is right so far. Now I'm looking for a Briggs 14 hp and hopefully I can find someone willing to trade one for my original. I think its a 23D. After that a safety switch, fire extinguisher and paint. Should come out pretty cheap. I'm one of those people who has to be "different", tell me I "can't" and I "will" There are no Simplicities in the club so I want one. Nobody runs Briggs so I will. They say I "can't" build a competitive puller without putting 3 or 4 grand in the engine. It might not be a consistent winner but it "will" be competitive. So with all your tricks and tips we will see what happens. Thanks in advance and Lets Build A Puller!!!

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HubbardRA
Dan, Your club obviously is not running stock classes. The club I pulled with allows up to 14Hp in the 900 stock class. The engine is supposed to be stock with governors at 3600 + 10%. They check at 4000 rpm. That is why we are running a 14 Hp Kohler. Cheapest engine I could find. Came off some junked equipment at a local golf course. Paid $250 for it. Our high dollar engines are in the stock altered and pro stock classes, not to mention the motorcycle classes.

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rokon2813
your right no stock classes. smallest is stock altered light (1000) lbs then stock altered heavy at 1100 lbs. Same tractors run both by just adding weight. Other than that the rules are pretty close. If you run at 3600 rpm its ok but after that you either need heavy shielding or billet flywheel. 14 hp is maximum but it can be bored up to .40 over ported and the head milled as long as the head is original I think. If your interedted I'll see if I can find the link to the club site. The next club over East from us runs an Off the Lawn class which is what I'd like to do but I dont wanna drive that far all the time. I am consideribg it though. The simp as is weighs 876 with the wheel weights on and I think they are 40 each so if I took those off It should be 796. I'd love to run it in an 800 pound class as is. I think it would do very well in first gear since the engine is just tired enough it wouldnt break the tires loose in second before stalling. Our club runs up to 4 cylinder car engines as well as diesel. Last year I guess they ran V8 but didnt have enough entries this year for the class.

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MikeES
Dan, I was gone camping for week, so this reply is late. Great feeling to prove the "old school" wrong. That is one reason we run the ACs. Most pulls that we go to we are the only tractors that are not Cubs. Sometimes we see a Wheel Horse and other Simplicities but it is rare. It is fun to beat the establishment with something different. ACE started out as a 12hp Briggs, we got the same feedback, the belt drive will not work and neither will the Briggs. We were pulling against 16hp polished Kohlers in Cubs. The 3rd pull that we tried we got a 2nd!! It took us awhile to learn the weighting and gearing. Both tractors are underpowered compared to the competition, the engines are bone stock, DEUCE's engine has orginal rings in it. Both tractors are consistantly in the top 4, so we beat the competition with the tractor and not the engine. Good Luck, Dan and let me know if you need any information, I will be glad to help.

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rokon2813
I did find out there is a Simplicity in this club if you want to call it that. They turned the bgb down 90 degrees and put a pulley on where the driveshaft flange should be and are powering it with a 13 hp vertical kawasaki motor. They also put wheelhorse sheet metal on it so unless you look close you cant tell its simplicity.

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