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Attaching AC B-10 era tiller to B-210


Kent

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Kent, I'm going through the same thing thanks for the info. I need to check out the tiller to see its origin first. The big pull is on the left instead of right and I have no drive assembly. I do have lift assemblywithout the rod. Beamer
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dlcentral
If you wanna see that puppy REALLY dig throw a 16hp big block on-er! dlc
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I just wanted to follow up on my earlier messages to "record for posterity" what I found it takes to attach an older B-1/B-10/Big Ten/B-12 era tiller to a B-210. I think this will also apply to AC's B-110/B-112/B-212, along with Simplicity models 2110, 3012, 3112, 3210, and 3212. So, I thought it would be beneficial to record it... I purchased an old, non-running Big Ten last fall that came with a tiller. Tiller is a 32" with the optional tine extension kit (making it a 40" wide, if desired). Owner/operator manuals were included for both tractor and tiller, but the tiller manual does not include an AC MFR # for the tiller, nor is there a label on the tiller. Since the manual had a date of 4-62, I "guessed" that it would cross-reference to a Simplicity Mfr # 990392 and went from there. According to the "What Fits" section, this would require Simplicity kit 103085 -- but this kit is no longer available, so no help there.... My B-210 had no rear lift assembly installed, but thanks to Jeff Nemes, I had one off a B-10. To install it, I had to make my own 40.5" long (overall length, to the center of the holes in the clevises) rear lift rod, since the one off the Big Ten was only 36" and far too short. By measuring, I determined that the later tractor with variable speed tranny was between 4" and 4.5" longer from the bevel gear box back... I purchased a round 1/2" diameter cold, rolled steel bar, sawed it to length and threaded (SAE 20 thread, making sure I'd have plenty of thread for adjustments) it to accept clevises on each end. (Big Ten OEM rod only has clevis on the front, with a 90-degree bend and a clip to attach it at the rear). I installed it, and with minor adjustments (easy with plenty of threads on both ends) made it work without it touching the tranny in the "full, up" position. I did have to saw off a bit of excess, so I'd guess the best length for the rod is about 40" to 40.5" from the center of the holes in the clevises.... Next, I installed the tiller drive assembly from the Big Ten, only to find that the "guide assembly rod" that's used to put tension on the tiller idler pulley/clutch was also too short. I made one out of 1/4" steel rod, bending it 90-degrees and drilling a hole for a key in one end, adding the same 4" of additional length to compensate for the longer wheelbase -- only to find out that it was now too long, so I sawed 1.5" off it, leaving it only 2.5" longer -- that worked. Next step was to add a 3" drive pulley to the bevel gear box to drive the tiller. Note -- not the 5" pulley used on the B-210 tiller -- the B-210 and Big Ten have different tiller drive assemblies with different size pulleys all around. Final steps were to transfer the belt release guard/bracket from the Big Ten to the B-210 and to add the 8" longer (than the one from the Big Ten), now 64" drive belt, Simplicity part # 105280. Note that the belt release guard/bracket are essential since these are what keep the belt "pushed together" enough at the front, next to the 3" drive pulley, to where the idler clutch pulley will actually clutch the belt and the drive assembly doesn't turn.... Yes, I tried it without it, and it won't work -- without it, the tines keep turning even when the clutch lever is disengaged. One final point: I had to "fiddle with" how I connected the tiller clutch lever to the guide assembly rod, trying several combinations of washers, shoulder bolts, etc., until I found one that would: (a) clear the pulleys on the drive assembly, and (b) clear the rear of the fender/seat platform. This is very "tight" since the B-210 fenders extend back about 2" farther than the Big Ten/B-10. It finally stopped raining long enough for me to try it out on Sunday. Boy does it dig, especially with my B-210's hydraulic lift so you can "push it" into the ground! One caution, though, without the hydraulic lift in the "float position" it will tend to pick the back of the tractor up off the ground and send you scurrying across the ground if you hit something that the tiller can't dig up and toss out -- like some of my New England rocks. My solution was to "till upslope" as much as possible, where this tendency is not nearly as bad, and let it "float" as much as possible. It even tossed out some rocks at least 6" in diameter.... I'm very impressed with the tiller, and how well my 10HP Briggs handles it. It only started bogging the engine if I was in really wet ground, digging almost 8" deep. (Note though, that I was not using the tine extensions.) I accomplished more in about 3 hours with it than I did in 2 days with my little 5HP Troybilt Pony last year.... Hope this long post is of some value to someone else!
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Guest Jef
Now that's some piece of documentation Kent! I hope you took some step be step pics for thoses of us that like looking rather than reading! Don't you love it when a plan finally comes together! Who was it that said that - the "A-Team" or was that the "SimpAC-Team"? :)
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dlcentral
To avoid going across the lawn at 60mph when hitting rocks lighten up a bit on the down pressure and make 2 or 3 passes to get it to 8" the perfect depth for your garden. dlccc.....
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Kent, Would your conversion let me convert my B-1 tiller to fit my new Sovereign?? Thanks, Roy
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Perfect timing Kent! I'm doing much of the same thing. I found that the 64" belt seems to be much too long, and I wonder if the tiller clutch I'm using is for an even older B series (I have the B112). I have another clutch assy, which came from a newer simp. (3415 I think it is) I found in a neighbors back yard, and I thought they had the same size pulleys, but now I think I should check that again. I do not have the gearbox guard/bracket. I have begun to make the bracket part, and, based on your experience, it sounds like I'll need to make the guard part too. Would it be possible for you to post a picture and dimensions of the guard/bracket? I'm especially interested where the hole should be located for the clutch rod to attach to it, and how much space there should be between the guard and the pulley. Thanks, Greg
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Greg, I'll see if I can get a picture scanned in from the owner's manual that shows the belt release guard & bracket and provide you the measurements. (It's a busy AF Reserve weekend, so be patient, please.) Here's a pic of what looks to be the same tiller and a similar tiller drive assembly as mine installed on a B-110 or B-112. Note the really large pulley (at least 8" or more) taking the power from the 3" drive pulley and transferring it to another pulley (about 5"), which connects to the tiller drive pulley that's about the same size (maybe slightly larger). What you can't see in this picture (in addition to the belt release guard and bracket), perhaps due to shadows, is the clutch engagement lever and idler pulley. The clutch engagement lever is RIGHT beside that large pulley on the back of the drive assembly and on mine, actually comes up to almost touch the rear fenders when the tiller is engaged. This one may use a different idler/clutch lever and pulley setup, since the lever is obviously not in the "up" position in this picture.... Roy, sorry but I can't help you since, like "Sgt Schultz" on Hogan's Heroes (boy am I showing my age) --"I know nothing" about the new Sovereigns.... Kent http://www.simpletractors.com/images/b_attachments_images/tiller.jpg
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Kent, I have the owner manuals for both the tractor and the tiller, so please don't bother scanning for my benefit. If you have a picture of your bracket/guard on your tractor, that would be the most use. The dimension for the rod hole isn't really that critical either, as the rod has plenty of adjustability to it. It's just hard to judge the size of the guard, and how far it is from the pulley from the line drawing in the manuals. I planned to just use examples of other pulleys around the tractor to estimate where this should be, but based on your experience, I think I should make this adjustable in case my best guess doesn't work. Greg
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