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Chris727

Ebaying for tractors

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Chris727
Have any of you guys ever been "Sniped?" I think I'm done with ebay. I saw something on the news about sniping software. I was bidding on a tractor that was close to home and had lots of parts I needed. I bid in the last 15 minutes, was high bidder until last couple seconds. I kept upping my bid and held the high bid but it seems somehow the sniping software knows a persons high bid and can place a bid faster than physically possible at the very last couple of seconds in an auction. Is that cheating?

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cckemm
Nope it isn't cheating. The idea behind proxy bidding, you just put in the maximum that you are willing to pay, then as long as the sniper isn't willing to pay more than you, you will win. Snipers work on the fact that although you were willing to pay say $200 for that tractor, you put a bid in $5 higher than what the high bid was at the moment. Then tried to keep raising your high bid while you were being outbid. This can be avoided by just putting in that maximum amount right at the get go. Even if you do this in the last 5 mins of the auction as long as you are willing to pay more than them you will always win.

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dratkinson
eBay recommends not using the sniping software. Yes, it works, but it can not handle some of the auction situations. An auction that ends early. The sniping software knows the posted auction ending time and has no way of knowing when a seller ends the auction early. Maximum bid time. eBay tracks the time of the maximum bid. Say you place a maximum bid of $100 on an item 3 days ago. I come on today and also place a maximum bid of $100 on the same item. Result: you win because your bid has an earlier time than mine. For me to win the item, I must up my bid. Your maximum bid. eBay bids automatically for you up to your maximum bid. The item price does not move higher unless someone tries to out bid you. If you have the starting bid on an item for $1 and a maximum bid of $100, if no one else bids against you, you will win the item with a $1 bid. Reserve prices. If there is a reserve price on the item, the bidding will go up until you cover the reserve price, or you reach your maximum bid, and then the bidding will stop there. If you cover the reserve price, you get the item ... unless you are out bid. If you do not cover the reserve price, you don't get the item ... however, the seller may change his mind later and contact you. What does all of this mean? The guy with the earliest high-bid is supposed to always win. The possible exception is for an auction that ends early because the seller sold the item locally for more than the eBay auction bid. But even then, the high-bidder won, he was just local and not on eBay. So what does this all mean? Place your *maximum* bid for the item and forget about it. eBay will bid for you until you win the item or you lose the item, and this includes auctions that end early. If you lose the item, and you really, really wanted it and would have paid more, then your initial maximum bid should have been what you really, really would have paid. /r David

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KSever
Don't own any sniping software nor do I subscribe to any sniping software. BUT I have been sniped alot of times and I have sniped alot of times. Seems to be the way of EBay if you want to keep the bidding price low. I have bid on a few items on there when they first come listed then to find someone else with a feedback rating of (0)decided that they just want to bid to see my bid go up. So I find if I just sit back and keep the item I want to bid on in my watch list until the last minutes of the auction it usually will not climb to a high price. Works for me MOST of the time. And no I don't think it's cheating it's called an auction. Just like calling out "going once,going twice, (I bid) sold". Most of the reason I invested in 2 way Satellite Internet was because of Ebay.

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cougar
I have to wonder how many of the 0 feedback bidders are the seller bumping the price up. With hotmail it doesn't take much to get a new email address, which is all it takes to set up a new Ebay account. A few times I have seen a 0 feedback person bid to my max then quit. Sniping could be stop by require a short extention of time to the auction (a minute or two after last bid). Most of time I will open bidding with the opening bid then wait until the last 5 minutes to do most of bidding.

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cckemm
cougar, The seller has no way of knowing what your max bid is. so if they had another account to push the bid price up they would be walking a fine line of not outbidding you. If they did they would end up losing at least their listing fee's. They could recover their final value fee's but that takes ahwile.

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KSever
But the seller can have another bidder bid to see how high you have bid, then he can retract his bids and leave you at your highest bid. Then he comes back with a bid just .01 cents under your max bid and the seller has a made more money for his product. This is exactly why I usually wait to bid until the finish of the auction. I have had this same thing done to me as a bidder.
quote:
Originally posted by cckemm
cougar, The seller has no way of knowing what your max bid is. so if they had another account to push the bid price up they would be walking a fine line of not outbidding you. If they did they would end up losing at least their listing fee's. They could recover their final value fee's but that takes ahwile.

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PatrickE
I will usually bid about half of what I would go to get started, then just wait till the last 10 minutes. I won't get into a bidding war with someone that has 0 or real low feedback because its probably there to boost the price up. I have 2meg cable hookup and 3 computors in the same room, so I can have the bid page up 3 times with different numbers and just smack the enter keys. I can usually beat snipers if I want something real bad.

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toad270
Depending on your IP and how long it takes to get the bid in you should wait until the last minute to bid. Not 15 or 10 minutes before the auction ends. That gives even people with the slowest dial up connection a chance to raise there max bid up enough to beat you.

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Tjlep
I am an eBay seller and buyer and feel sniping software is fair to use as some people can't be at there computer at the time of close to get there last bid in. As far as bidding, I have been beat out several times but have won quite a few. I watch the listing in the last few minutes hitting reload on the browser and watching the remaining time. At 30 seconds remaining I start counting down to the end entering my final bid, depending on the speed of your connection, click submit bid as your count enters 2,3,4 seconds left, have had success doing this. Hope this helps

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Kent
I use sniping software sometimes, and sometimes I don't... As discussed above, sniping software gives you the chance to make one maximum bid of what you're willing to pay, and then eBay's proxy bidding takes over from there. All the sniping software does is to submit that maximum bid as close as it can to the end of the auction. It uses and follows eBay's rules -- it doesn't violate them in any way.... There is no difference in using sniping software compared to delaying your bid until the last possible moment, and manually trying to "beat the clock".... It just automates that process.... That said, I have only limited success using sniping software. Very often, I'm not willing to pay as much for an item as someone else, and their bid is as high or higher than mine. Their bid still wins by one of two ways: (1) if I've bid the same maximum amount, they'll will if they've submitted their bid first, either manually or using sniping software, or (2) the maximum amount that they're willing to pay is higher than mine and they simply outbid me at the last minute. Even using sniping software, I lose more auctions than I win -- but that's because I'm not willing to pay as much as someone else... and that's completely fair. That's just the way auctions work -- going to the high bidder. In contrast, some things I buy using the "Buy it Now" price... if it's realistic and I'm willing to pay that amount. Other times, I'll manually bid the maximum amount I'm willing to pay. Sometimes I win, sometimes not. Overall, sniping software improves my chances, but it certainly doesn't guarantee that I'll get the item. The only way to "guarantee" that I'll get the item is to place a maximum bid higher than anyone else is willing to pay.... Sniping software doesn't change that -- it only impacts the timing of the bid, and avoids "running up the price" in the early bidding. So, overall, IF I WIN the item, I think I usually get it a little cheaper than if I've manually entered a bid, and EBay's proxy bidding keeps me in the bidding... but there's no way of knowing for sure. Bottom line -- if you want to increase your chances of winning, don't manually bid low and keep upping your bid as others bid. Instead, bid the highest amount you're willing to pay and if someone outbids you, and if you lose, then accept the fact that they're just willing to pay more than you, and that's totally fair.... You win some, you lose some, and some get rained out.... ;)

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bud119195
If i really want something bad I usually wait till the last minute . or use buy it now if the price is fair, I waited till the end on a 637 once and got it for $11.37

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Guest
I think eBay can be hit or miss, both buying and selling. If there are people actively watching, it doesn't mater if you wait. If people are less actively watching, waiting might help. Selling, your effected the same way.

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Guest
I should add one thing I observed. It's the hey if that guy thinks that is worth that much, I'll go $1.50 higher; those are the people who do 8 to 10 bids to get to another person's high price. When you loose by a $1.50 to one of those people, then you're pissed. That's what the "silent bidding" (aka last minute or sniper bidding) does away with. If they don't have time to one up your highest price once you set that price and they didn't bid their absolute highest price they'd pay, then you avoid that with late bidding. Resulting in a won item. So does silent bidding benefit the buyer and hurt the seller? I bet it hurst the seller, because it takes away the drive up the price senerio. (modified the last sentenance to make it make sense. Sorry)

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maxtorman1234
When i got my 410S over ebay, I had no trouble at all. Just kept increasing my bid by about 10.00 at a time. Went 27.50 over my max, but i still got a good deal.

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Guest
I've re-read this post and boy did I learn more. I still think Sniping only hurts the seller, but only when an item is not "Hot Hot"; because a sniper will only get a gain at the loss of a novice. If an item is hot and there are more than one sniper, then it doesn't mater, like everyone talkes about above. If an item is luke warm, a single sniper will beat the novice, provided they didn't bid up their maximum bid or don't know the value which a sniper is willing to pay. NOW...What I learned from above, is what I was suspecting. There are ways for seller to drive up prices at the risk of paying the listing price; I think that is wrong. I suspected a seller who contacted me when a bid fell through. I've gotten beyond any worries of that by being confident I know what I am willing to pay. Interesting post here. Thanks all.

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lbeckm3
quote:
Originally posted by michaelg221
NOW...What I learned from above, is what I was suspecting. There are ways for seller to drive up prices at the risk of paying the listing price; I think that is wrong.
You are correct, that is wrong!! It's called shill bidding, the problem is it's very hard to track down and prove. And, it's not just eBay - the same things happen at live auctions. For instance, evil auctions inc. hires a couple of plain clothes "auction goers" to do some "bidding" for them. Then when your bidding on your item, one or more of these "phantoms" bids against you until they reach a certain price, or think your ready to drop out. Then they stop and you pay more than you bargained for. Heck, sometimes they don't even hire anyone, you'll just hear a "YEP!" from one of the auction helper people and NO ONE ACTUALLY BID!! The safest way to avoid these types is to do your bidding from the back and watch the crowd closely. I guess bottom line is bid what your willing to pay, no more. Also, if your looking for a good snipe site (rather than software you load on your computer), I use one called www.auctionstealer.com - nice thing is it's free for like 3 auctions a week and you can purchase more later if you need to. I have absolutely zero to do with these guys - I'm just a very satisfied user of the service. YMMV.

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Guest
lbeckm3- great reference and good point thanks. I've got to revise one thing I said. My statement that Sniping only hurts the seller when novices are involved, well actually it really is not hurting the seller; it's the sellers loss due fairly based on novices on eBay. I'm not sure how eBay can even that out, I thought silent auctions (i.e. don't expose bids until last minute), but then you don't get the drive up the price action. That's what sniping stops.

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