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ted411

PTO clutch conversion 3212V

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ted411
Hi, I have a 1970 3212V that we have owned since new. It has been a very good tractor. We mowed a 2 acre yard with it until we bought a new simplicity in 93. However, its weak spot has always been the mower pto. It has the type of drive which hangs down and uses two belts to drive the mower, one of which is a double V-belt. This has given us constant trouble since new. Anyway, I would like to covert it over to the cone style clutch like our new tractor has. I have a donner tractor (7013 w/48" mower)however the donner has a shuttle shift and the shaft is too short on the right side of the center gear box. It needs to be longer so the sheeves can slide on it for the varible speed. Anyway, does any one know if there were any model tractors which used the cone cluch and had the 3 speed variable speed transmision? It looks like some of the early to mid 70s tractors were so equipted (71,72,73?)The shaft would have to be about 15" long, measured all the way accross from the end of the cone clutch to the end where the variable speed pullys mount. I think everything else will work except I need a longer shaft. Thanks for any information Ted P.S. If anyone has any ideas where I could find a shaft like this I would appreciate a heads up(I am located in Maryland).

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D-17_Dave
I too have an HB212 with the double v-belt. However have not had much trouble out of it. There are a few diff options. You can easily change it to a single v-belt by swapping the sheaves or try to determine what is causeing the problem with the double. The only problem I had was the occational dropping of the deck in a rut where the whole deck dipped at once and would trow the belt. I latter found out that the bearings were a little worn and loose on the center spindle allowing the shaft to quickly change angles on the belt abruptly and cause it to throw the belt. Replaceing the bearings all but elliminated any problems with this setup. It sounds as though you have the rare occation to atempt a swap where 2 options, the cone clutch and the variable, make a strange combination to find. I wouldn't dare say you can't find what you need but such a hybrid would be diff. to find a replacement part for in the event you broke down. Hope this helps, Dave.

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thedaddycat
Simplicity went to the cone clutch starting with the 3400 series, any variable from then on would have the right BGB cross shaft for variable drive and cone clutch PTO. The earlier PTO with the "W" belt can be converted to single "V" belt by using the same pulley that is on the BGB-to-PTO end of the PTO cross shaft. You will loose the second smaller sheave on the output side of the shaft that is used with the sickle bar mower.

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SmilinSam
you cant use a Cone cluitch and a Variable speed setup as there were never the tractor made equipped like that thus you will not find the proper cross shaft for the ger box unless you pay a machine shop to make one. The variable speed were last made on the 3300 series and they still used the old style pto. When they came out with the 3400 series they dropped the variable speed and the old style PTO. You could do a complet conversion and put the shuttle and pTo onto your older tractor. Would likely be easier than the variable to hydro conversions Kent and I did in the past. To look at a step by step pictured documentation of these conversions go here: [url]http://www.simpletractors.com/do_it/variable_to_hydro.htm [/url] and : [url]http://www.simpletractors.com/do_it/variable_to_hydro2.htm [/url]

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Kent
The conversion kit converted the "double-V" style belt to a single belt. I agree with Sam -- the variable and cone clutch were never offered on the same tractor, as far as I know...

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Kent
Marty, The output shaft on the right side of the BGB is longer and threaded on a variable speed. The output shaft on the left side of the BGB is longer and threaded on a cone clutch. No tractor I know of has both -- so something's gotta give -- you can't have both with factory parts...

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ted411
Thanks for all the help guys. I was afraid that there were no models which the varible speed and the cone clutch overlapped. The problem we always had with the old setup was that the mower deck had to be set at just the right height(usually to low for most situations) and any type of bump or dip would throw the double v-belt. I may talk to a machine shop about lengthening the shaft. I am going to keep my original untouched in case I want to convert it back to original or if I can't get this to work :) I did see the conversions you did SmilinSam. It looked neat but I am not sure of the condition of my donor rearend and I don't really mind the 3 speed. If anyone has any more ideas I'm all ears. Thanks Ted Thanks

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SmilinSam
quote:
Originally posted by MPH
Kent, thought maybe the right side was longer on the shuttle drives also. Too new for me to know, didn't have them on footdraggers you know.
The shuttle was offered starting on the 3400 series and the 700 series Allis Chalmers. The Shuttle, Hydro, 3 speed, and 6 speed tractors all used the same bevel gear box and same shaft. The Shuttles used a deep "belled" pulley while the 6 speed tractors I think had a special double pulley. While not collectible like the old Yellow AC's the 700 series AC tractors are fantastic when it goes to robbing parts from other 700 series as most all the parts interchange, and the frames are all pre drilled for all the transmission variations. Easier to get used parts to keep em going in other words.

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UCD
Just taking a stab at this but was you trying to set the height with the lift lever? The cutting height should be adjusted using the adjustments on the roller bar and the yokes in the front. Running the decks with them raised on these tractors will either wear a belt by rubbing, throw the belt from the pulleys or break it. The mowers decks on these tractors should be lowered before engaging the PTO and disengage PTO before raising it. With belt guides/stops in place and spring tension on the PTO and correct length OEM belt (not cheap aftermarket they are not designed to twist 90°) you should not have any problems.

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