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Ed_H

2110 Landlord Differential

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Ed_H
I have an old 2110 LandLord which suffered a broken axle tube. I purchased a transmission on eBay and replaced the axle tube in the original transmission. On my old machine, the large differential gear inside the differential housing is attached to the wheel hub. I thought that was the connection between the differential gear and the axle. When I got everything back together, the axle tube rotates with the drive pulley so the transmission(gears) seem to be working fine. The rear wheels seem to be free spinning however. There must be a gear loose somewhere( probably in my head). Has anyone had this problem and can offer any advice.

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HubbardRA
Could be that you left a key out somewhere in the assembly process. Does the outside housing of the differential turn with the axle tube? It should be keyed to the tube and move with it. If the housing moves, then check the key that connects the gear to the left side axle. Also, jack the rear wheels up off the ground and pull the left side axle as far out of the tranny as the slack will let it move, then adjust the collar on the left side to remove this slack. The keys, or slack that lets the gear on the right side hub disengage from the spider gears are the only things that would keep the wheels from turning, if none of the gears are broken.

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Ed_H
Thank you for your response. I do have a couple of more questions as I'm not sure exactly how the differential works. I believe the differential on the rear end I removed the axle tube from was a newer model. The large differential gear was keyed to the axle and held in place by a ring. On the older differential from my tractor, the large differential gear is attached to the wheel hub and comes out of the differential when the hub is removed from the axle. In the newer differential, the smaller gears around the outside of the differential do not rotate. I assumed they were just frozen from non use and age. The same gears in the older differential turn. What I am confused about is how power is transfered to the axle from the differential if those smaller outside gears turn freely? I hope this all makes sense! None of the transmission gears are broken and in fact are in great shape. The axle tube turns at different speeds when the drive pulley is turned and the transmission is in the different gears, including reverse. So I believe everything is ok to the axle tube. Have you ever seen a differential with the gear attached to the wheel hub? Maybe I am mistaken and the gear is just frozen to it or somthing. When the axle tube broke, it really tore thing up inside including breaking the key slots out of the axle. I replaced the axle also. The differential is keyed to the axle tube and turns with it. Ed

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HubbardRA
The outer gears in the diff housing are what I called the spider gears. On the later model axles, they are spring loaded against the housing to produce a limited slip effect. You will not be able to turn them with your fingers, but they will turn under load. There are two large gears like you are talking about. One is attached to the hub of the right side wheel. The other is keyed to the axle which drives the left wheel. Both those gears mesh with the gears in the housing. You need to understand how a differential works to understand how the connection provides power to both wheels. When the housing turns it moves the shafts that the spider gears are mounted on. The spider gears are set up in pairs that mesh with each other. One side of a spider meshes with the gear on the left side axle shaft and the spider on the other side meshes with the gear on the right side hub. When the housing rotates, it pushed both of these gears and makes both wheels rotate. If you are going in a straight line, the spider gears do not rotate on their mounting shafts. They only rotate when you go around a turn and one wheel needs to go faster than the other. You did not mention the big gear on the axle. As I said above, it is the same size as the one on the hub. If that is not in place then the wheels will not turn. The spider gears will rotate with nothing to react against to put power to the left axle. This gear is #12 in the picture below, and the keys that hold it to the axle shaft are #13.

If the diff is intact and you don't want to take it apart, you can install the inner pieces by loostening the collar on the axle at the left side of the tranny behind the left wheel and pushing the axle thru to the right till the collar is against the left hub. This will push the axle out far enough to get the internal parts mounted on it. Use this technique to check and see if the parts are in place. The re-assembly procedure will be: Install a washer #10 onto the axle. Then insert the #13 keys into the slots in the axle. Then install the gear #12 onto the axle and line up the keys. You may have to use a block of wood or a brass drift to drive the gear onto the keys. After installing the gear with the turned down portion (no teeth)pointing outward toward the right wheel, then install the other washer #10. These washers have notches to go over the keys. Now install the snap ring #14 and then washer #15. At this point, install the right hub with the gear on it, and install the locking collar with the outer edge flush with the end of the axle. Once these pieces are installed, then push the entire axle and hub assembly back toward the left side of the tractor. Make sure the gear on the right side hub engages the teeth of the spider gears in the diff and goes fully inside the diff housing. Pull all slack of the axle to the left side of the tranny, and slide the left side collar against the tranny to hold the axle in this position. If all these parts are correctly in place, then the diff should work properly.

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Ed_H
I told you in my first post that there may be a gear missing. In was in my head because I didn't understand how it all worked and I had not installed the differential gear which keys to the shaft. This morning I realized that my 7116 has the same basic rear end as the old 2110, so I read that section of the 7116 manual. It cleared things up a lot. The old 2110 had a different style differential without the springs. Slippage was provided by a slip ring in the wheel hub. I have no doubt that sometime over the years someone overtighten the bolts on the wheel hub which probably lead to the axle tube breaking. That and me trying to making the 2110 into a dozer. Now that I think I understand all I know about it, I tore down the newer spring style differential, cleaned, lubed and reassembled it and installed it on the axle tube. The only trouble I am having now is getting the differential gear for the other side over the shaft keys. The axle I am using is the new style with the wheel hub welding to the axle. This prevents the axle from coming through the axle tube far enough for the key slots to be outside the differential. Thanks for the installation procedure. The book was not too clear on the sequence. I am planning on using the same wheel hub that was on the tractor but replace the slip ring set bolts with plugs. That way the hub should just free wheel on the axle and wheel slippage will be with the spider gears in the differential. Thanks again for your help. Ed

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Ed_H
I just had a thought I'd like to pass by you. Do you see any reason why I couldn't move the lock ring for the differential futher back on the axle tube and move the differential closer to the transmission. This will allow me to install the differential gear on the axle outside of the differential where I can see the back side of the key slots. What do you think? Ed

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HubbardRA
You should be able to pop that ring out of the groove and slide it farther back on the tube till you get the gear mounted on the keys. I'm not sure how far this will allow the diff to move. All four of my tractors have the late model limited slip diffs and welded hubs on the left side. I have one of those diffs in my 61 Wards (Simp 700). I put mine together same as the diagram. I assembled the diff housing and spiders over the axle gears. That is the hard way. That is why I told you to do it the other way. I even put washers under the springs in the diff to make the limited slip even tighter, since I was using it for tractor pulling when I put it together. I had to use longer bolts to pull the pieces together, then one-by-one I replaced them with the stock bolts. Took a while to get that one together. That rear was out of a later model AC 716H.

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dirtsaver
Wow Rod! Looks like you've got the drive system repair down to a science. How about I send you about five tranny/axle assemblys to recondition so I can get a few of my tractors up and running. Seriously, your rundown is a big help to my understanding what I'll be doing this winter.

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HubbardRA
Larry, If you compare the drawing that I posted with the drawings in the manuals, you will see that the washers are also positioned differently. I put a diff from a 710 into my 716H and both wheels were locked together. I followed the manual. In order to get the diff working properly, I had to move one of the spacer washers. The positions in the drawing I posted are the correct locations. If I followed the manual the axle gear would engage both sets of spiders and prevent them from rotating. Yes, I have had these diffs apart several times. Only thing I ever broke, though, was axle keys. Never replaced any broken gears.

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HubbardRA
Roy, I live in Fredericksburg VA. It is a pretty good drive from your part of PA. Mapquest says about 317 miles. When you say the diff is slipping, do you mean that it wants to spin only one wheel when it hits a slick spot or in a heavy pull? My 713S and 716H are both like that. The only one that I shimmed with the washers is the 61 Wards. All I did was put a washer under each of the springs to compress them a little more and make it harder to turn the spider gears. This does require that you take the diff completely apart. By-the-way Roy, you can double click on a person's username and view his profile. This is how I found out where you live.

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landlord2110
Yes, the left tire spins and makes a mess in my lawn when going up a slight incline(when theres grass to mow, my lawn is burned up). I tried turning set screw tighter with no helping the situation.

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HubbardRA
Roy, If yours has set screws, then it is the older type, and doesn't have the springs in it. The diff that I shimmed is a newer type (limited slip). Even the limited slip units will spin one wheel is many cases. That is why I shimmed the one unit for pulling. This was so that I didn't have to run the diff with the spider gears locked. Yes, the spiders can easily be locked to prevent them from turning, and make both rear wheels always turn at the same speed. I wouldn't recommend it, because then the tractor does not like to make any type of a sharp turn at all. It will either push the front wheels, or force one of the rear wheels (usually the one on the inside of the turn) to slip and tear up your grass. The only diffs that I know of which can be adjusted in any way, is the later model limited slip units. Even then, you will have to use my modification of putting the shim washers under the springs to increase the friction in the unit. This is something I came up with, and your local small engine shops are not going to know about it, or be willing to do it. As I said, it has to be the later model diff, since there are no springs in the early ones. The only friction in the early diffs is from the nylon pads that the two screws press against.

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HubbardRA
Roy, I am suspecting that maybe the nylon pads that the screws push against are worn out. I think those screws are supposed to be torqued to 20 ft-lb, also. I do not have any of the old type diffs in any of my tractors. If it didn't come with a limited-slip, then I put one in. I was never happy with screws in the hub, and I like the welded on hub on the left side.

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Ed_H
Rod, Just wanted to thank you again for all of your help. The old 2110 is alive and running. The rear end is very tight and very quite. I can tell the differential is working because the wheels are turning at different speeds around turns. Maybe someone here can help me with a different problem on the same tractor. The metal gas tank has almost completely rusted out. A couple of years ago I priced a new one from Simplicity. They wanted $98.00 then. I removed the tank, dryed it good and coated the outside with JB Weld. It has held for a while, but after sitting for almosta year while I got around to fixing the broken axle tube, the tank is leaking again. Does anyone know of a plastic replacement tank which will fit a 2110 Landlord. I would like to replace it, but JB Weld is always an option! Thanks again Rod. Ed

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landlord2110
ED_H I tried a coating called KREEM. it is 3 parts to it. Part A is a rust remover. Part B is a cleaner & Part C is the coating. Its been 3 months so far and is working so far. Its a liitle pricey, but cheaper then a new tank.

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Ed_H
Rod, I forgot to tell you about moving the lock ring on the axle shaft. It worked like a charm. I moved the differential towards the transmission enough to mount the washers and differential gear on the axle in the clear. Then I slid the differential out over the gear, slid the lock ring back into position then mounted the wheel hub and locking collar. I used the orginal wheel hub which had the nylon slip ring and lock bolts in it. I removed the bolts and carefully removed the nylon slip ring which left a depression in the center of the hub under the bolt holes. I cut both bolts off and inserted one as a plug. I drilled the other bolt head and inserted a grease fitting. The hub is now free spinning on the axle, the same as with the hubs from tractors with the spring differential. Ed

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