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comet66

Ross Hydraguide valve

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comet66
First...My apoligies for turning an auction posting into a discussion thread. It was unintentional. Now, this auction posting is for a "power steering kit". http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=57483 The seller tells me. "The control valve is on the end of the cylinder where the two hoses are connected.You can see it in the picture." I do not see in the pictures what I now understand is known as a "Ross Hydraguide valve". (Simplicity calls Steering Unit Hydrostatic #1673686.)

This is the same system as on my Sunstar, and Ultima. I have seen them in 3, 4, and 5 port configurations. I just didn't know (or had forgotten), the proper name of it. My question is. How is this supposed to work without what I had previously refered to as a control valve? The steering wheel has to talk to the hydraulic cylinder in order for it to know which way to move. I know I'm missing something here, but I can't figure out what it is. Help!!

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Ronald Hribar
When the steering linkage applies pressure on valves contained in cylinder it either pushes or pulls the linkage to the front wheel. The standard arm from the gearbox to the front wheel is in two pieces. Ford Farm tractors also used this sytem. The control valve is built into cylinder. Ford cars used this until 1965.

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HubbardRA
On the 1972 Ford Maverick that I had many years ago, the valve was on the tie rod and the cylinder connected from the frame to the tie rod. The pitman arm connected to the valve. When you turned the wheel the pitman arm moved the valve which activated the cylinder. Motion of the cylinder (and tie rod) would remove the actuation force from the valve, in other words bring it back to a neutral position. It took only a little steering force to activate the tie rod mounted valve, and the hydraulics did the rest. Since this unit pictured in the auction is specified for a Sovereign, I think I understand how it works. If I am correct, it replaces the current draglink. The left end bolts to the steering arm at the spindle. The right end bolts to the chassis (probably on the same bolts as the crossbrace). The short rod in the middle attaches to the steering arm link. The control valve is the silver area where the short link is attached. The rod comes out of the right side of the cylinder and moves the whole assembly fore and aft as the draglink would move. The steering is used only to activate the valve. This is a similar system to what was on the Ford that I talked about above. Some Corvettes also used this type of power steering.

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gregc
Here's the Setup Instructions and Parts List for the Power Steering Kit that is on ebay... if anyone is interested: http://www.simplicitytechpubs.com/6767PRINT/PDF_files/TP_200_3726_00_SK_S.pdf

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CarlH
I have been collecting parts to put one of the late style power steering system's on my 7790. The later system is essentially the same system as on a Sunstar. The steering valve is the HydraGuide pictured and the power is supplied by a conventional hydraulic cylinder that replaces the Sovereign draglink. There are various brackets, a different steering arm, and hoses needed to install the later system. The system in the eBay auction is an earlier Sovereign system that works like the seller describes and appears complete to me. A parts breakdown for the early system is in the 7100 Attachments parts manual.

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DarrylF
I installed a new power steering system on my AC 914 last winter. The original post and the picture from the eBay listing appears to be the same system and looks complete. Mine came in the original box with all the little pieces in plastic bags. Only the hydraulic cylinder was assembled. The unit on eBay was either installed on a tractor or preassembled by someone who really knows how it goes together. I went through the same questions you have, but once I had it mostly together it became obvious that the link from the steering actuates a valve in the hydraulic cylinder that sends hydraulic pressure to one side of the piston or the other. My system was intended to be installed in series with the hydraulic lift. If the one on eBay is the same, one of the hoses will be too short and the kit will not have the fittings needed to tap directly into the hydro pump ports. If you have hydro lift, you'll be fine. Also, since mine is in series, I can either lift or steer, not both at the same time. My friend has a later model Sovereign that has the power steering system shown at the beginning of this post. We haven't figured out how that system actually works, but it does! If you do a lot of maneuvering with your tractor, this power assisted steering is great. However, if you do mostly straight work, be aware that due to the way the valve works (either pushing or pulling), you'll be constantly applying little corrections to go straight. I have 50 fruit trees and a 1/4 acre pond to mow around plus the usual lawn trees. My hands used to hurt for a day or two after I finished mowing. Now just my butt is sore! Good luck! Darryl

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roma3112
Darryl I have the "other" type of power steering with the gear/valve part of the steering column and I agree with you as far as not having to touch the steering. I have about 3/4 of an acre that I mow and lots of trees and manuvering, and a great big wide open area with nothing the power steering/hydro lift is a definite plus. The only gripe that I have is that when you step on the brake/clutch you loose steering/lift. Ideally the steering and lift would have its own pump so you could brake and steer at the same time.

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HubbardRA
John, That setup must be hooked to the hydrostatic tranny charge pump. This is how my hydrolift is also hooked up. I get aggrivated because the hydrolift will not work with the clutch pushed in also. This is especially true when trying to hook up to a trailer with my liftable rear hitch. When I put the tranny in neutral, sometimes it creeps just a little. If I push the clutch/brake to hold the tractor still, the lift won't work. This makes me end up having to hold the hydro tranny lever with my right hand, while controlling the lift with my left hand. Not easy to turn around watch the lift in this position. Been thinking about making a parking brake that doesn't disengage the clutch to eliminate this problem.

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MPH
All you need to do Rod is get a FDT tractor with Live Hydro lift.:) I remember well when it was the newest cats meow introduced on farm tractors. Dad put an after market system on the Farmall H with the loader on it, Sooo sweet.

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HubbardRA
Marty, Unfortunately those FDT hydrolifts usually sell for more than I paid for any of my tractors. I would have had a very cheap hydrolift on that 716H if hadn't gotten in a hurry and decided to walk into the local hydruaulics shop and say I want "these hoses", made to "these lengths", with "these fittings" on the ends, and then have to purchase the additional 45s and 90s to get the lines to lay right underneath the tractor. When I got the bill, "Ouch". This is why I have around $200 tied up in my hydrolift. Over half of that was hoses and fittings. For sure, I will do it differently next time I put one of these lifts together. Planning one for the 7116H, but already have valve and cylinder.

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MPH
Well darn it Rod, I sure can't dispute that. Paid going average price for mine, had to rebuild it and put new hoses on it. Didn't add up the total but I know it was more then I paid for the tractor I put it on.

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