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stumpy

1972 Montgomery Ward 16 hp

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stumpy
Hi folks, A fella just offered me a 1972 16 horse Monkey Wards tractor (manual tranny) with a deck, tiller, belly-mount sickle-bar mower, and trailer for $500. Supposedly it needs paint and a seat but has no cancer and is otherwise in good shape. Ran when parked two years ago...turns over now but wouldn't catch. All implements are good except the mower deck might be a bit stiff and need some lube. I haven't seen it and have no pics (sorry). It's about 300 miles from here and I'll be there on Friday. I'm trying to remember if this machine would have been simplicity built or not...if memory serves correct the MW looked something like a 3416 with a different grill? So....does anyone have any opinions to offer on the machine? I still have my B-112 and Homesteader, but while I was gone last year someone borrowed my tools...I have one little blade on the H-8 and a big one on the 112, and what's left of my blower. No deck though, and the Mrs. and I just signed papers on a place with a few acres and I'll need a deck and a tiller for sure. Thanks for the input

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goatfarmer
Bob,that one's probably a Gilson built tractor.Depending on what it needs,some parts may be made of "unobtanium".A Gilson built tractor will have GIL in the start of serial number I believe. If it is,there's a great bunch of people here: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GilsonCollectors/ I'd base a price on what it needs to get it started.Might be a simple carb overhaul,or a simple set of points,or a stuck valve,maybe a little more serious.

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D-17_Dave
I'd say if your going all the way down there if it's in any kind of shape don't come home empty handed. Even if it's a Gilson you could part it out and seperate the attachments and end up with some booty for something else.

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stumpy
Thanks for the input fellas. Kenny and Greg, I think you're both on the right track...just received a message from the guy and he said the model number started with "G11," but I'd bet it's really "GIL." The "unobtanium" factor is a bit troublesome on parts. I still have a great little Gravely 430 commercial that sits due to it's missing coil/electronic ignition module for it's troublesome Onan 12hp one-lunger. I was cobbling a scratch-built ignition system for it...had all the parts but now I can't remember...??????? Ugh. From the sounds of it, the problem is with the cast iron Briggs 16...no problemo there...just like the 12 on my 112 or the 16 on my bud's 3416, I believe. So, I take it parts for the Gilson built tractors are tough to come by? I will go take a look and use the unobtanium factor to drop the price a bit. I'm looking to use this thing as opposed to making it pretty (although this winter I'm sure it would get the works). Thanks again

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goatfarmer
If it's got a Briggs,engine parts shouldn't be a problem.The problem arises with parts like deck arbors,spindles,etc. I believe Gilson was bought by Lawn Boy,who was bought by Toro.So some things might still be available through a Toro dealer.

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goatfarmer
I wouldn't let "unobtanium" stop me from buying it,if I were interested.Some parts for a B1 are unavailable,didn't stop me from getting 2 of 'em....

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Kent
quote:
Originally posted by stumpy
From the sounds of it, the problem is with the cast iron Briggs 16...no problemo there...just like the 12 on my 112 or the 16 on my bud's 3416, I believe. Thanks again
Bob, The Gilson uses a different oil pan that is actually a part of the front frame of the tractor, believe it or not, and isn't removable. You have to unbolt the engine from the oilpan to pull the engine... :(? But, you can put a normal 12-16HP oil pan on it and use it in a different machine, like a Simp/Allis. I have a 15HP that I pulled out of a Gilson. Also, they have a different (lower) starter/generator mount and a long dipstick and filler tube that requires you to open the hood to check the oil... You MAY need to use a different starter/generator mount to keep the belt from rubbing the side of the frame on a Simp/Allis. Otherwise, they make excellent engine donors.... As far as the tractor and attachments, they're VERY heavy duty units but the strangest engineering I've ever seen. Seems like everything is designed to be at least 3-times more complicated than the Simp/Allis... what Simplicity would do with a bent, shaped linkage rod and ball connectors on each end, Gilson would use three different, interconnected rods and all the hangers and brackets to connect them, and make each one adjustable... As we used to say to describe Lucas electrics on British sportscars -- "... those engineers certainly had a warped sense of humour!"

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stumpy
Hiya folks, Looked at the stuff the guy had. No pics yet...it's stuffed under the Mrs.' pile of boxes, etc. in my stock trailer. The tractor was a Gilson 16hp with variable drive. It has wheelweights, ok rubber, and an extra set of front tires and rims. The trailer was junk so I left it. The tiller is a large wheelhorse unit and not for the MW/Gilson...that's a shame, but it is a well-made tiller and in great shape, so if anyone has a need for one????...or I'll modify it. The deck is rusty but repairable...three blades with a rear throw...it sends the grass out the back like a windrow...rather interesting. But....the real gem is the Haban BELLY-MOUNT sickle bar mower. It's complete and hardly used. Little bit of rust here and there from sitting but that's about it. I gave the guy $200 for the tractor, deck, wheelhorse tiller, and the sickle mower. Figured it was worth it for the mower alone and then some. I do like some things on the Gilson though. The mechanical pto system is a slick design, I think...overly-complex, but nifty. I'm likely going to fix this up and use it with the sickle bar only. On the other hand, there's a 12 hp MW/Gilson with a tiller attached to it sitting in a front yard in the neighboring town. Looks like an early 70's model in good shape. I might go offer 'em something for it. Then I'd have a tiller and sickle mower with a tractor and a parts tractor...and now that I have room for stuff that's OK. I prefer Simplicity (and Gravely too), but there just isn't much stuff out in this neck of the woods. I could use a tiller and a better deck and snowblower, etc. for the B-112, and a deck and maybe a snowblower for the Homesteader, but haven't found anything (after searching long and hard). Makes the machines neat but not very useful, ya know? Soooo....if I can come up with two of these with mower and tiller attachements it becomes an option. Thanks for the input...like I mentioned, if anyone is looking for a wheelhorse tiller I can get them the model number off of this one....and I might be looking for a tiller for a MW/Gilson. Thanks

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