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Simpleton7016

Hydro conversion

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Simpleton7016
Welp, finally got some tractor time. I took a vacation day and spent it with Bob (BLT) converting my 912 to a hydro lift. I got all of my parts off of a 7117. Except that a couple of potential problems have arisen that will require input. I will chronical the entire job (with pictures)once it is complete. First, a couple of pictures: This is the ONLY way I would ever consider doing this again. Standing the tractor on end for easy access. Creepers are for the birds!

And here is a picture of BLT slaving away. The only downside of standing the tractor on end is the number of times you hit your head on the front tire when standing up from a seated position. I counted that Bob hit his head no less than 8 times (he says it was more like 80) :D That number does not include the number of times he his my bicycle seats which were hanging from the rafters near by! [V]

Here is a picture of the cylinder ram from the 7117:

And here are some pictures of the problem we encountered:

So what we have is the age old problem of how best to fit a round object into a square hole? We thought of two possible options, but I wanted to tun them by the rest of the gang for opinions. Option number 1: grind down the ram to have two flat edges to fit between the brackets on the lift arm mount. Option number 2: Spread out the brackets on the lift arm mount so that the ram will fit between them. Were the lift arm assemblies really different from the factory for a 7117 and a 912? Or were the rams different? If you don't mind, can I please learn from your experiences and/or mistakes? Any suggestions?

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stevenj
The distance between the ears on the liftshaft of a on non-hydro or electric lift tractor is 3/4". On the hydro lift tractors, the distance is 1-1/8". The electric lift apparently has a 5/8 or 3/4" shaft where it attaches to the lift shaft while the hydraulic ram has a 1" diameter shaft. You could have the ear that is closest to the rear cable lift bracket moved. If you could put the shaft in a lathe and have the weld on the one side of the ear machined down, you should be able to move the ear over and weld it back onto the shaft in the new position. I'm considering doing this to a non-hydro lift shaft, I just need to find a machine shop willing to give it a try.

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Simpleton7016
Thanks guys and rats! Anyone have a hydro liftshaft laying around off of one of the latter machines that Greg described? Otherwise, it is back out to Emmers I go. (I used to live right near him, but these days it is a pretty good hike that I have made too often in recent months. I.e., it's gonna be hard to convince my wife to go out there aaaaggggain) :) Wait just one second....better yet Lloyd, if you have one of these, get it ready. I am coming up by you on Sunday morning so you can probably gauge the heck out of me on this one! :D

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stevenj
quote:
Originally posted by gregc
The only 7100 and 900 series tractors that had the wider spaced ears on the lift shaft to fit the hydraulic ram were the 7116, 7117, 7119, 7790, 916, 917, 919, and 920.
Right. And the liftshafts with the wider spaced ears were not available with the manual lift. The LH side of the liftshaft was cut flush with the frame.

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Ketchamized
Simpleton7016, I would leave the brackets alone. It would put undue stress on the welds, imo. Out of the options, I think #1 is the best and the safest way to go. That way, the strength of the shaft will be virtually the same and the brackets would not be put at risk of weakening one day and breaking off. If you went with the #1 option, I would personally grind the shaft down enough so that a hardened washer would fit on both sides of the shaft and fit between the brackets without forcing the brackets. The washer would give a good transition between the movement of the shaft and the brackets. In addition, I would be careful about how far back on the shaft the grinding goes. It has to be long enough so that it would not hit the sides of the bracket when you operate the hydraulics. Also, it should not go so far that it leaks at the hydraulic cylinder mouth.

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Brent_Baumer
I made this same conversion on a 7016H. I simply changed out the cross shafts as well as D-17 Dave suggests. Worked like a charm. If it works going to a whole different series I cannot imagine it would not work for you on a 7117/912. Frames on those machines are much more similar than on my 7016H. Keep in mind, the 7000 series did not have available hydraulic lift that I am aware of: [img]http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/attach/Brent_Baumer/H1.jpg[/img] Brent

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Brent_Baumer
By the way, make sure you get the springs, shims and check valves out the the donor hydrostat or your ram won't lift sqat. HubbardRA was the first to do this conversion that I am aware of and he has some good photos and instructions re: the hydrostat on here. I certainly would not have been able to do mine without his post on the subject. It helped alot. Here are some links I hope you find helpful: [url]http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=true&TOPIC_ID=46227[/url] [url]http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=true&TOPIC_ID=51515[/url] [url]http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=true&TOPIC_ID=51704[/url]

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Simpleton7016
Where are the springs shims and check valves located? And where do they go? I thought I snatched everything off of the unit that I needed. I didn't see anything else when I took this unit off. The donor tractor is gone. Calling Dr. Lloyd....Dr' Lloyd, line 1 please. :D

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Brent_Baumer
You can't see them from the exterior. They are inside the hydro pump. Go to the links I provided and you will see what I am talking about. You can still buy them new (as I did) but it will cost you about $40. These are very small parts. I have a pic of all the little packages in one of my links as well as Rod's link has the diagram on how to install them. Also, if you have access to a tractor that has hydrolift it is very helpful to be able to refer too for positioning of the lift lever and routing of the hydro lines. Fortunately I had the donor carcass as well as a 916H w/ hydrolift on it to refer too when I did mine. It will be very difficult to get the control valve body positioned correctly without a reference, that is unless your 7117 already has the hub in the frame. I don't know if they all came that way or not. I had to make one out of a pipe nipple as my 7016H frame did not have it. Why would it afterall since the 7000 series did not have hydraulic lift available.

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Simpleton7016
oh yeah, I do recall that thread. Somehow, I thought those little pieces might be inside the threaded brass fitting. Rats, but thanks. I guess this is all a blessing in disguise because had the lift rod fit correctly, we would have completed the job and Bob and I would still be scratching our heads wondering why in the heck the thing woudn't lift! That is, if he still had a recognizable head to scratch! (since he would have bumped it at least a dozen more times!):D Thanks guys!

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BLT
quote:
Originally posted by Brent_Baumer
Did you get the conversion complete? If so, how does it work?
Well a week was lost because of Erik being out of town and I went to get relief valve and and rock shaft shaft. Got valves, shaft was gone. Command decision on Erik's part, grind flats in ram shaft. After that, it was routing and hooking up the hoses. The funny part was when the tractor was started nothing happend. There was a couple of stupid looks and two or three attemps later still produced nothing. Took off charge pump and everything looked fine, put it back together and nothing. Well took off pump again and had a harder look at it and gave the pump shaft a better look. There was a hole in the shaft and something should go there. We heard something eariler hit the floor when the pump was taken off but didn't think anything of it. After closer inspection on the floor we found the pin that drives the charge pump gear installed it and started tractor again and still nothing happened. I told Erik that maybe spinning the pump housing 180 degrees would solve the problem. Did the work and tried again and nothing. Erik hit the travel lever forward, said "darn" and at the same time the charge pump picked up the prime and the tractor lurched forward. After that it was stroking the ram a bit with the lift lever and after that things went fine. It was a fun afternoon. The other half of the installation team.

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Simpleton7016
Yep it is working great. Only had a chance to do a little tiling with it so far. Maybe 15 minutes worth. It is much easier on the arm cuz those rototillers are heavy! I have the snowthrower all hooked up and the belt routed....but I forgot that I need the 900 series lift lever....so it is out to Emmer's I go tomorrow. Bob is a gosh darn genious! And very patient too. Had he not been then, I am certain I would either still be working on it or have broken something by now. He was/is probably a great father/grandfather. It was a fun project, but I still need to tie back some of the hoses to keep them a good distance away from the driveshaft. Knowing me, I will keep putting it off until some day when I have 5 quarts of Dextron fanned all over my icy driveway!!! By the way, does anyone have a good shot or set of shats to show where the hoses under the tractor get routed? Mark, you are more than welcome to stop by anytime. I will leave the tractor out in the lawn and you can babysit my kids and look at the tractor while the kids run all over! My wife and I will go out for dinner. [:0] PS, if either of you two turkeys need anything, let me know by tomorrow cuz it is off to Emmer's I go for the umpteen thousanth time! It's a darn good thing that he is enjoyable to BS with....:D

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BLT
Erik, do you remember DA 917, a trip to Roscoe? It has a hydrulic lift. If weather is good this weekend, I'll run it up on the ramps and get a couple of shots or so. Tom (gobble, gobble) Turkey^^^

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