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DorneyMA1

Lawn vs Garden Tractor; your version

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DorneyMA1
Please explain what makes a tractor either a lawn tractor or garden tractor. I thought it was the HP but I see the earlier ones called Garden Tractors but the B-10 has a 9 hp, is that a lawn or garden? Is it the size of the tractor?? the attachments it can handle? And with the Simplicity line, I hear the 3000 & 7000 series are garden type but the 5000 isn't, is there a rhyme or reason to the numbers they used??? Thanks

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Fred
Mark, all the factors you mention bear on the distinction to some degree, but the most essential one is "implements". A garden tractor is usually thought of as one capable of handling "ground-engaging" implements, such as a moldboard plow. Many lawn tractors are able to handle a small tiller, for example, but can't stand up to dragging a chunk of iron through the dirt. That ability is related primarily to frame and transaxle strength, more than power. Even an early, low power garden tractor will do it because it was designed with no more power than the other components could absorb. Other factors such as hydraulic lift, three-point hitch, shaft-driven PTOs and such only muddy the water as they are designed in or not depending on the price point of the tractor. But if they are all present, you are pretty much assured that it's a garden tractor. Power, especially on modern tractors, is not a good indicator as it is used as a sales point on the chain-store brands. No way does that piece of junk at Sears need that nice Kohler Command 20 to swing that cruddy, poor-cutting 46 or so inch deck, as an example.
I'm not qualified to address Simplicity's model number lineage, however.
Hey guys, how about someone else talking to Mark? Even though he's nearly a neighbor, I'll bet he's getting tired of hearing from me. Oh, that's right, I could just shut up!
Fred

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dlcentral
Hi everyone,it is most defenete that everyone has their own opions as to what is and what isn't a garden and a lawn tractor. So lets deal with some facts ok? But lets not decide what is a tractor by wether it has a horizonal shaft or veritcal shaft engine. Let alone useing weight as a determining factor. Example-just because the newer landlords have a vertical shaft engine does this mean they are not"garden tractors"? Just because it is 54 pounds lighter then its partner the Soverign which has a horizonal shaft engine exclude it from being a "garden tractor"? The landlord weights in at about 670 pounds and the sovereign at about 724 pounds not includeing any attachments. At 54 pounds lighter the landlord should with its larger gas tank 5 gal. verses 3 gal. full come even closer to the sovereigns weight. Even if someone can or can not pick up the front of one of these what factor does this have? I sure don't need a strained back trying this way of decideing the difference. And heavens lets not even go tire size as everyone can change that at anytime. Oh horse power don't even go there either as this means nothing except more is better at least that's what some people beleive. We all know that the tractors are designed to compensate for this. Just look at some of the off brands with a 36" deck and a 16-1/2 horse power engine and then look at my piddlely 9hp with a 42" deck. And I sure hope that everyone is talking about Simplicity tractors here as we all know that they are the only ones worth talking about anyway with the exception of AC's or other members of their family. To me a garden tractor is just that a tractor that was designed to use garden making attachments period. A lawn tractor is just that one that can not accept garden making attachments but it in most case's will out cut quality wise most garden tractors as it was designed for cutting grass plus some can plow snow and blow it and basically do lawn type chores. Yes weight can be a factor on how a tractor performs,as can horse power and even tire size. But if you can't put garden making attachments on it then its a lawn tractor plain and simple. This is my opion and so lets all deal in facts here. I do not claim to be write on all of these or any of them. Its just like I said my opion on the difference's between the two. Thank you gentlemen and lets play ball and have a great time while were at it. And feel free to correct me on anything and everything if need be as everyone is entitled to there own opions also. Everyones Friend-> Jackl-happyjack <->And what time is the game and who's house is it at?<-

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dlcentral
Hi Mark, It was nice talking to you on Sun chat,boy do I feel sorry for you having'you know who for a neigh'--just kidding no nasty e-mails please!!Without getting long-winded,what I tell folks is look at trans on unit,if it's an aluminum one it's a lawn trac. also look at frt. axle,as that's a giveaway as to what your looking at.Tire size used to be associated with the difference but it isn't anymore. The 3000 ser. Sim is a lawn trac. Actually I'm jeaulous of you 'cause I wish'you know who' was my NEIG!!

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tej
Mark, When considering the older garden tractors with the 9, 10, or 12 HP motors, those were the biggest motors Briggs produced at that time. I agree with Fred's explanation but with the junk their building these days it's hard to put exact rules on it. One rule that I think still applies is if it has a vertical shaft engine then it's a lawn tractor or lawn mower. Some one correct me if I'm wrong but I know of no real garden tractor with a vertical shaft engine. Tim

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tej
Broadmoor has a vert. shft. eng. but is still considered a good sm. gard. trac. It has a cast iron trans heavy frt axle and has rear earth digging attachs for it. I'm talking of course abt the older units, not the newer ones! Am I right Mr. Nemes?? dlc

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dlcentral
Hi Mike, I honestly thought you were refering to your self also. But sometimes its hard to interpret ones thoughts verses what someone has written. We all are different in this way. I for one saw it as you refering to yourself but sometimes it can be hard to write on this board and be able to put are feelings and thoughts behind each and every word that we type without sometimes some of us misinterpreting what actually was meant. I know as this has happened to me before were someone has typed something and I thought they meant it some other way. All's it takes is for one word to be left out and that one word can change the meaning of a whole sentence or how it is interpreted and I am not saying you left a word out. Its just how each and everyone one of us can read the same sentence and interpret it differently. I don't feel you owe me any apology so save mine for some other time. Thanks anyway->jackl<-happyjack<-

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dlcentral
Sorry for the misstatement Mark,who by the way this thread is SUPPOSED to be addressing. The 3000 ser. Sim. is a garden trac, my mistake! Nice discussion to all posters INCLUDING MYSELF!to our new friend Mark who must think very critically of all this nonsense! Sorry. dlc

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DorneyMA1
Thanks for all the replies, I figured it might generate some varied opinions. I look through those old photos and see some of those tractors with loaders and fork lifts and they don't look that big, it's just a bit confusing since I haven't been around tractors long. Thanks again!!!

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tej
I agree with Tim that a good rule of thumb is a horizontal shaft engine means a garden tractor. Also if you can lift the front of the tractor (even slightly) it isn't a grarden tractor. A garden tractor has the mass weight (not just the horsepower) to handle the attachments. You don't want the tail wagging the dog. "dlc" the 3000 series i.e. 3110 thru 3414 are garden tractors.

MS

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DorneyMA1
First off , sorry mike for over reacting. I was at work and a little stressed at the time. Now Braodmoor the final word. In the 1999 Guide to Simplicity Tractors & Riding Lawn Mowers, the Legacy, Sovereign, and Landlord are listed as Garden Tractors. The Broadmoor and Regent are listed as Lawn Tractors. Quote from the brochure "TECHNICALLY THIS IS A LAWN TRACTOR. But considering Broadmoor's durable construction, exceptional cutting ability and wide-ranging versatility, it's more accurate to call it a LAWN TRACTOR with a garden tractor's heart. Broadmoor is the only LAWN TRACTOR on the market to offer Automatic Control Traction". Simplicity makes it and calls it a LAWN TRACTOR. That should settle the debate. Tim

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tej
DLC, The Broadmoore is a nice tractor but it is a lawn tractor by most standards of lawn verses garden. Vertical shaft engine and smaller wheels. Some lawn tractors have tiller attachments. I've seen a Sears lawn tractor with a CAD loader on it, but it's still a lawn tractor. Tim

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DorneyMA1
To all who took part in this disscussion,I for one thought this was one of the best topic's in a very long time. Not only that I for one have learned not only more about our tractors but even more so important about all of us that took part in this discussion. Thanks to all for the fantastic way in which all conducted themselves. Not only just one of your fellow members but a friend to all.->Jack Lindstrom->happyjack<-

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tej
Mike, I wouldn't use the ability to lift the tractor as a rule to define a garden tractor. I have lifted both the front and back of my B12 when I wanted to move it to the side in the garage. Of coarse I am 6'1", 250 LB, and insane. Tim






















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tej
Impressive Tim. But actually when I have checked out some "tractors" for friends I have tried (carefully and safely) to tip up the side or pick up the front. If this is easilly done, I believe the machine is not heavy enough for tilling and snoblowing. What I'm saying is most garden tractors weight 700 to 800lbs. minimum vs. most lawn tractos weigh half as much.
Just a strong back compensating for a weak mind.
MS.

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dlcentral
Everyone's got their own version on this 1.- Sears DID make a garden trac[suburban] 2.-What does the term'garden trac' mean: "able to jobs in the garden" which the Broadmoor fits that definition[just barely!] Like I said before Mark you have a small version of a garden trac.CASE CLOSED!! Good Luck with it!

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Al
The things Simplicity uses at Marketing meetings is if it can drive a tiller, it is a garden tractor. Ex a new 18 hp 50" Broadmore is a lawn tractor, an 18 hp Landlord is a garden tractor, though both have the same engine and deck. The old Broadmores ie 738 etc had tillers available and were advertised as garden tractors, though only 8 hp. This is what we have been lead to use as the determiniing factor. Al

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