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mbrook

7016 Front PTO

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mbrook
I recently aquired a front PTO from an AC 712 to put on my 7016. Last night I was trying to hook up the engagement rod but failed. The rod appears to be too long. But I may have had it routed incorrectly also. I was wondering if anyone had some pics of the front PTO installed on a Briggs engine. Along with pics of the proper routing of the engagement rod. Thanks

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GregB
I'm at work now, so I do not have pics handy. But I know that the Briggs installation and Kohler installation use different pivot holes on the clutch engagement frame. Also I did have to adjust the little stud nut that goes thru the clutch frame at the front also when I installed mine. GregB

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DaveM
Using the part number from the blower, download the manual from the Simplicity website. It gives detailed instructions on how to set this up on both engines (Kohler and Briggs). If you can't find a part number, use 1690033. That's the number on my blower. Should be exactly the same instructions.

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DanD
Here is the clutch installed on my 7016. If you need more views, let me know.
[img]http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/attach/DanD/Without%20spacer.jpg[/img]
ALso, here is a link to the manual from simplicity. Pto assembly is toward the back of the manual.[url][/url]http://www.simplicitytechpubs.com/6767PRINT/PDF_files/TP_100_3264_00_AT_S.pdf Also, does a 712, have a Kohler engine? If so, pay special attention to item #5 and Figure 21 on page 18. You have to mount the fork to the bracket using the different set of holes on the Briggs engine. Also, the bolt in the end of the crankshaft is smaller on the Briggs, as I believe are the bolts that hold the bracket to the engine block.

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mbrook
Thanks for the pic, that helps with the clutch part, sort of. I have the manuals and have been studying them. On mine the clutch fork, when in the proper Briggs location, almost hits the block of the engine before it engages with the clutch plate. Which makes me wonder if I need to have the spacer that goes on before the keyed clutch plate. As for the routing of the rod. Again I have looked at the manuals, which are very helpful, but they lack the vertiacl location. What I'm wondering is does the engagement rod go over the brake/clutch shaft or under, and same with the jack shaft, does the rod go over or under. Also, there is a sleeve (?) in the side of the frame that appears it might cuase a conflict.

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mbrook
I still can't get my pto set up right on my 7016. So I'm looking for some more insight. Last night I studied the complete set up as it should be installed on the tractor. What I noticed was the step in the crankshaft seemed too long when compared to my 7013. When measured it was about 1/4" longer. Since I purchased the 7016 in a state on dispair and no previous history, I am not sure if the engine is tha original or not. This 1/4" difference could/would make a larger difference when the clutch is activated/de-activated. When comparing to the pic that DanD supplied, my clutch arm (the part that pivots, and is attached to the block) nearly hits the block when in the engaged position and does hit it when I try to dis-engage it. Also the engagement rod still seems too long. I'm 99% confident that I have it routed properly, but when the rod is in the disengaged location it nearly hits the front frame of the tractor. So I guess what I'm looking for is: 1 - A measurement of the step in the crank shaft / or a distance from the block to the back side of the PTO. 2 - Was there two different engagement rods used for the front PTO (I have not been able to find two, yet) Thanks again. Mark BTW, I'll try to post some pics tommorow, if I can get some decent ones.

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Simpleton7016
I have been running off of the center PTO of a 912 for a couple of years, but prior to that, i had been running the thrower off of the front PTO on my 7016. Two things come to mind that were problems for me. First is the route of the engagement rod....I struggled mightily before I got it right. Second was the cap screw at the end of the shaft. There is a fine line between getting it tight and stripping it out. If the latter, then you are screwed (pun intended). But my clutch would not engage correctly until I got that thing cranked all the way down and very tight....be sure to grease it before you put 'er in.

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rsnik
Hi Mark, Sheesh is it hard to get under the tractor and get pics. I have a 7016 with original front manual PTO. The rod goes over the top of everything. The pics are useless, you can't tell where the rod is, but you can see where it isn't, LOL! I read that manual (thanks DanD). Did you see where you use the front 2 holes of the clutch mounting bracket to install the swinging bracket on a Briggs and the back 2 holes for a Kohler? Did you switch the swinging bracket to the front holes? Also the handle not only moves the rod forward but downwards so that a tab pushes down on the plunger of a safety switch. If the engaging arm on the lever has swung around to a different point (ie it is at 1 o'clock position when it needs to be at 8 o'clock position the rod would become way too long or short at the front. The first pic shows the rod way up there above the rock shaft. The second shows the PTO, notice the swing arm is mounted on the front 2 holes of the bracket. Frankly I can't figure out what the last 2 pics show, all I know is I was on my back under the tractor pointing the camera at the rod, LOL!








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mbrook
Wow, thanks very much for the input and the pics. For those of you who have not been laying under your tractor for hours trying to figure out where the engagement rod goes, the pictures probobly don't make much sense. But for me, they are a huge help. I'll be printing them and and bringing them home tonight or tommorow to compare to mine.

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mbrook
Well I didn't get any pics of under my tractor but I did get a couple of the PTO. I think this is where some of the problem lies. As you can see from the pics the step in the crank shaft is longer than that stated by Rays.


Which in turn will put the pulley too far away from the block, so the clutch plate will not be able to disengage.


Even when I do get the engagement rod routed properly, which I know now it currently is not.


So in order for me to get the correct measurement from the block to the back side of the pto, I'll have to machine down the spacer. Looks like I won't be using this tractor the next time snow flies.sm02 Oh well, at least I now know what I need to. Thanks, thanks to all at this site.

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2burning
Say, you don't happen to have part B and E switched around? I can't even remember if that's possible or not. Another idea may be to space the mounting plate out away further from the block instead of machining the crankshaft.


And could the rod being way to long be because the arm B below is 180 degrees out of place? I guess rsnik already mentioned it...


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DanD
I posted the first picture in this thread. I have never been able to use the spacer (B in the diagram above) because the whole clutch assembly is pushed way too far ahead. Comparing my tractor with the measurements given by RayS above, he has a distance of .875 from the oil seal to the first step on the crankshaft, while mine is about 1 3/8". Apparently the crankshaft on my engine has the spacer built into it already. I overhauled this engine a couple of years ago including a new crankshaft, but I ordered the crankshaft for this model 326431 engine with the 0127 code number which is part number 691797 (there are 14 different crankshafts listed in the parts book depending on the date and type of the engine). It should be the correct crankshaft for this application. All I know is that without the spacer, the clutch, shift rod, and belt all line up perfectly and it works perfectly. I'll have to measure the old crankshaft which is still in a box at my dad's place.

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