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New Allis-Chalmers Lawn Tractors Info


JimH

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Thought I would pass this info on as there has been questions on the new Allis lawn tractors. I Just spoke with the only Simplicity dealer near me (50 miles)who will be selling the new Allis lawn tractors. He is expecting delivery sometime in March. The retail price is suppose to be Approximately $1900.00 and $2124.00 for the two diferent models. The entry level Regent is about $100.00 or so more Supposedly, the only major difference between the Allis and an entry level Regent is the Motor, (single cyl on Regent, twin cyl on allis) and the mower deck's. Heavy duty Murray deck on Allis w/o rollers along back like simplicity has.
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Already seen the new AC. Unfortunately a poor version of a greater lawn tractor. Give me the 700-900 series again! Dad was right, older is better, even a worn out AC will STOMP a new what ever, and yes I am leaning the AC way....
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Simplicity bought Murray, then B&S bought Simplicity, and now has abstained the Allis name did not find out if the Chalmers will be included. going to look this weekend, there here in victor Ia. already. AGCO is not part of Simplicity any more as far as I'm told today.
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Hi all' There one on Ebay allready. [url]http://cgi.ebay.com/ALLIS-CHALMERS-TRACTOR-23HP-42-CUT-BRAND-NEW-2009_W0QQitemZ370157907302QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item370157907302&_trksid=p4011.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A4%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318[/url]
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quote:
Originally posted by AGCO918
Tell more about what your dealer told you on AGCO.
Chad, the subject of Agco was not brought up. This dealer sells only Simplicity and now the Allis line. There is an Agco dealer up the road from him. He does not sell any lawn and garden items.
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I hope someone from B&S reads this. Gentlemen reconsider putting some heavy duty quality back into your garden tractors. At least in a model or two. Sell the plastic particle piece (ppp) machines in the home improvement stores, but give us the availablity to obtain a real good heavy duty machine from a "built in America" company. We are proud of our machines and the names Simplicity and Allis-Chalmers. Don't let us down; we have been your loyal customers for decades. We would still like to be your customers. Thanks, Kip
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quote:
Originally posted by nateb17010
Simplicity bought Murray, then B&S bought Simplicity, and now has abstained the Allis name did not find out if the Chalmers will be included. going to look this weekend, there here in victor Ia. already. AGCO is not part of Simplicity any more as far as I'm told today.
As far as I know the order is, Briggs bought Simplicity and then Briggs acquired most of Murray's remaining assets after declaring bankruptcy as a deal to pay it's debt for engines supplied.
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Kip, they do still make a heavy tractor, its prominently featured on the Simplicity Manufacturing homepage: http://www.simplicitymfg.com/products/yard_garden_tractors/legacy_xl/ I agree its unfortunate they chose to put the murray deck on these "AC130's". I think its also unfortunate they chose to put the AC name on this smaller model rather than a conquest or prestige. Despite this I do not think it is fair to judge these small lawn tractors against the 700 and B-Series, which were top of the line models in their day. If you figure inflation, a 1970 48" deck alone (no tractor) would cost $1089.50 today. I went here: http://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl and adjusted the original list prices of these tractors for inflation: B-10 in 1968: $760 + 26 for pto + $158 for deck = $5603.63 in 2008. B-210 in 1970: $1016 + $158 for 42" deck = $6427.50 in 2008 HB-212 in 1970: $1338 + $199 for 48" deck =$8414.88 in 2008 If you added hydrolift to the HB-212 it would have totaled $9153.99, thats more than the base price of the Legacy (true shaft drive, and 4x4).
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Chris, I was thinking this is just a start, (right or wrong) to getting the Allis name out there for people who are still dedicated to the name. I think if these new machines work out, than we may see heavier duty models like we are use to seeing in the past. This is what Ikipp was referring to. Agco had it going for awhile, then they "killed" it. My 2 cents............
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Chris727 , how about comparing a new garden tractor and price to yesteryear . Toro GT420 , price today is $5620. Converted to 1970 dollars that would be $1026 with deck . But you are getting plastic vs steel . Massey Ferguson Prestige price today is $6700 . 1970 dollars would be $1223 with deck . etc etc The new Chalmers is a lawn tractor , not a garden tractor . Comparing apples to oranges . If you compare old to new as far as ability , toughness , etc you need to compare to todays machines that can take the implements and do the work of the old iron . When you do , you'll find that the prices are in the ballpark for inflation , but you are getting less steel and more plastic . Also have to consider things like plastic bushings vs brass of the old ones . Aluminum blocks vs cast . etc etc . If those old tractors were built today , they WOULD be expensive since they were not skimped on . They were made to work hard and many still do even after many years of abuse and lack of maintenance . Many still have the original engines .Think the new ones can take the same abuse and keep on truckin for 30-40 years? As far as the new Chalmers , it's a lawn tractor that costs around 2 grand . That would be about $365 back in 1970 . In 1970 you could get a Deere lawn tractor for $395 . A serf for the same . But can the new Chalmers use a tiller , blower, etc ? Anyway , just saying you can't use the inflation calculator to compare the new Chalmers to old since you are talking about completely different animals .
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it dose have the Allis Chalmers name on the tractor not just allis but Allis Chalmers and it's little, reilly little. white hood, orange body. with funky head lights in the hood grill. sorry not impressed but it is a start. YES ALLIS CHALMERS IS BACK!!!!! with that said yes it looks like a k-fart, or a home crap-o special. oh well it's still a AC/Simplicity and welcome back. looks kinda like a old paint skim from the 300 or 400 ac
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I was at my local dealer today and we were talking about the new A-C lawn tractors. They are an old Allis-Chalmers dealer dating back to 1935. He said he does not plan on ordering any of the new A-C's due to the fact they are using the Murray decks and not Simplicity decks. His sales rep keeps trying to talk him into ordering them. However, he told me that the letter that was sent to dealers introducing them to these new models stated in the letter that the current two lawn tractors available were "test pilots". So he thinks that means that if sales are good it will lead to new A-C's in heavier versions, like the Conquest, Prestige, and maybe even the Legacy XL. The next closest dealer about 15 miles away has two new A-C's in stock in crates. I've been looking at pictures of them and I think they look sharp. I like the orange and cream color scheme.
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Well I hate to say it but I would match my 1973 Simplicity 4041 against anything out there today, todays machines are nothing but junk from what I have seen, just like alot of things made today " use it a year or two and toss it " Pretty sad but true.
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If the major difference is the deck, could an regent deck be used on the AC tractor, or did they modify the hitch points too much. Or did they do the old simplicity tricks of just slightly modifying the hitch points so attachments would not interchange?
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Ptmmatssc, That is the point I was tying to make. I was pointing this out because others were trying to compare the AC130 to the older large framed tractors which are in a totally different class. The AC130 would be best compared against the 4211 regents which appeared in the late '70s. They had a lot of plastic, the dash tower, the grill housing, frame cover, and some of them also had an aluminum transmission. Thats not to say they weren't good tractors, there are many members here still running them.
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I think Briggs&Stratton is right on with their marketing strategy. The new AC 130 is at a price point that the average casual suburban consumer would buy. In other words, broader market appeal. If they had started at, lets say, a Legacy type tractor, there would be fewer buyers. The reality is that if the new AC line is to be truly successful, Briggs must be able to sell it to the "average Joe" in large numbers. Those of us on this forum are all happy that Allis-Chalmers is back, but we are just a small fraction of the market. If it has success, I would imagine that bigger and more sophisticated models, that would appeal to us on this forum, will follow.
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Hey guys, I was just reading all of your answers, and I just want say that it is nice to see that they reborn the Allis-Chalmers name. But if you are going to do one thing, do the other. Bring the Allis Heavy duty garden tractors back too. I am a true Allis fan, as you can in my photo gallery. These AC130's will die first before my 916 or my 917. What do you guys think?
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What a great looking fleet. Shows care and pride you take in your equipment. Maybe that's part of the problem with the new plastic tractors. Companies don't take the kind of pride in their products they use to. Guess the "buck" has become "boss". That has always been the case, its just more so now. Personally I'd pay a bit more for real quality. And no I'm not going to buy a Kubota. Prefer to buy the USA product. Are they still made in the USA?
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Its sort of ironic that Allis/Simplicity collectors have made fun of the Big Box mowers that are being sold (For good reason) in the last few years because of poor quality but are all excited because someone has put out a very similar quality mower with the Allis Chalmers name on it.Orange Paint job won't get the job done I'm afraid
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Just curious why the Allis name wasn't used after 1985? It appears that Briggs got access to it as soon as they bought Simplicity. I wonder if that was part of the deal?
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They need to put the simplicity deck on the tractor to make most of us happy.What is a few hundred dollors more?You cant compare old to the new.Yes the simplicitys are made out of metal which the box junk is most cases is plastic. They need to paint the wheels white like allis chalmers always were to make me happy & to put the better deck on is my issues at the moment until i can get to the dealers to see them first hand.Prices 30 yrs ago cant compare to todays products.They were made like tanks then & now everyday homeowners want cheap.That is why we are in the mess we are today.People dont have or dont want to spend money on Quality.I will spend more on Simplicity made products because i know they have quality.Most people arent like us on here in the few 1% who will spend more on quality.Makes me mad everytime i see the cheap box store junk.You get what you pay.I have owned 1 box store tractor when i started out,have been Simplicity Loyal every since buying Allis Chalmers/AGCO-ALLIS /now AGCO 2027 .Never will i buy cheap junk.Simplicity / Briggs, need to think about this before they make them to cheap to see to box stores.They will lose the market if on loyal people like us on here if they dont watch how cheap they make these allis chalmers tractors.I think they need to put the cheap deck on for box stores & have the simplicity deck on for the Simplicity dealers who sell Allis Chalmers brand tractors.
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quote:
Originally posted by acfarmer
Its sort of ironic that Allis/Simplicity collectors have made fun of the Big Box mowers that are being sold (For good reason) in the last few years because of poor quality but are all excited because someone has put out a very similar quality mower with the Allis Chalmers name on it.Orange Paint job won't get the job done I'm afraid
I think the excitement is more that they have a product they can compete with that's a bit better than that other junk. What other new tractor can you buy for 2k that has foot hydro, cast iron front axle, metal hood, and a 23HP twin? These days, it's all about features and pricing. While it isn't the quality "tank" that old AC stuff is known for, this is a good package for the price. You just have to remember that it's a lawn mower, not a garden tractor.
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