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bgin

4040 CCKA carb. and points setup

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bgin
first the problem, it started to miss and spotter and shake. Since it happend when the gas tank was just about empty I first assumed a bad glopp of gas, so new filter and checked out the carb. No problem there. Next checked plugs and points, and sure enough it was flashing as the sputtering was happening. So cleaned the point(quick cleaning with out taking them out). It improved, but not smooth yet. Changed the plugs. Got really good when idling but full throuttle it would miss. Took the point out and cleaned them good (they're just about new), changed the condenser(just in case). But still have the problem with the full throttle. Question is could my carb. be off? I reset it like the manual said 1.5 turns out, but havent checked the idle setting. why would i see flashing at the points at full throttle. I did set the points at .020 with the flywheel at TDC. Any help is appreciated. I checked past post but i'll check again just in case i missed something....

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bobjack
I have very similar problem with my 7018 with Kohler 18 single OHV. I don't know if the points flash under full throttle. They used to before I fixed wire and changed coil and condensor. It does seem that sanding the points helps some. They are almost new too. Have rebuilt the carb twice and tried everthing I can think of. 2 new plugs, coil, condensor etc. I just got this tractor last fall and don't know if it ever ran right from new. bobjack

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JeffG
You're on the right track but, also need to adjust the timing. Got a manual? Do you know how to do it? It's a little trickier with the CCKA's vs. the CCKB's. Also - the 1 1/2 turns out on the carb. main fuel adjustment is just ballpark to get you running. You'll need to do further adjusting to fine tune and get it running just right. I'd replace the points (again) and also the brass bushing, cam rod and points box gasket. I think the "flashing" is due to oil getting into your points box - which is pretty common with worn parts and will really foul things up. Good luck. Jeff

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Floydster
Setting the points on these old KA'S and KB'S are a real pain. The points have to be super clean, filing does not work, and sometimes even new points have to be replaced. The timing and point gap have to be right on the button. Any arcing of the points will cause a miss fire, I use carb cleaner to clean the points before I install them, and make sure your feeler gauge is clean. I have kept two CCKB's running for 20 years and I still have a heck of a time with the point adjustment. Also sometimes new condenors are bad. Been there. Floyd

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bgin
Just wanted to follow up. What I found was that the iddle adjustment on my carb. was just about closed. I set it to what the book said (1 1/4 turn) and now it sounds much better at full throuttle. So not knowing anything about carb. other than the basics, I assume that the lack of the additional fuel was the problem??....anyhow why lack of fuel=flashing at points? maybe i'm asking too much.... Anyhow we're in a drought here in the north east, so the lawn don't need too much attantions..... About the points, I have read that Onan does have conversion kit but for $160 or so...don't have a part number. Next on the list is to play with the governor springs, they don't look original. I have checked the speed with a light and it as the book said, but it hunts a bit. Thanks for the feedback, hope this helps others.....

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bobjack
Jeff, Thanks for your words of wisdom. Oil mist getting on the points would explain why my 7018 seems to run better for a short period of time after I sand and clean the points. I have been reluctant in installing a second new set just because it took me 1 1/2 hr to get the timing right the first time. Can the brass bushing and cam rod be replaced externally. I remember thinking that there was some wear on the rod or bushing when I put the new points in last time. I thought lightly about trying to retrofit old chevrolet points onto the kohler just to easily set the timing. They wer twice the size of kohler points though. Even similar points in fords years ago seemed much easier to set than the kohler -- then again, a 1 or 2 mil gap error didn't affect timimg since the timing was set by cranking the distributor after setting point gap. Chevy points mount in a different plane from the kohler points, maybe I should rethink that mod --hehehe -- if we could pull it off, there'd be a lot of us much happier about maintaining these things. bobjack

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bobjack
MPH, Right On -- I think there are small electronic conversions for about $10 for single with magneto such as your normal cheap brigs, but not for battery ign. systems. I spent an hour this afternoon surfing the net looking for a Capacitive discharge ign. system. Didn't find that exactly. The cap. disch systems from 25 years ago just used the points for a trigger and sent only small current thru them. They were 35 to 50 dollars back then. I did see MSD multi-spark entry level ign. for $79. I didn't see a pure electronic conversion for single or 2 cyl kohler types. I did see a full breakerless conversion (approx $200) for 4 cyl. ford 8n and similar size farm tractors with a distributor. Seems like I saw something about a conversion at a Pulling Tractor (for small garden tractors -- cub cadets) site about a year ago, I couldn't find it today. I did put another set of new points in today. The previous set (not very old) had a crack thru the rubbing block, the contacts were black and had small craters or pits in the black surface. I did find oil on the block surface behind the points and could feel slop in the point actuating rod. There is no replaceable bushing where the rod goes thru the block. The rod shows 1 or 2 mils of wear, the block is cast iron and I assume the hole is worn maybe more than the rod.I think I am burning oil mist in the points and causing the black coating on the contacts like I described earlier in this post. Normal pitted points are gray and never black like this set of points. All in all I was very frustrated and disappointed. This motor doesn't use any oil to speak of. I don't know what kind of repair could be made to stop the oil leak other than a new actuating rod which would only fix half the wear problem (I think) -- Anyways I'll get a new rod and see how much it helps. NOW, after installing new points today (Couldn't get a new rod today), it ran marginally better, still puking at full throttle, I have adjusted both idle and high speed jets for lean fall-off and rich fall-off and then set it half way between and blah, blah, blah. This motor was rebuilt in 1992 with new rings, valves and maybe a piston by the previous owner (now deceased, so I can't ask him anything). He supposedly rebuilt it because it never ran right from new, but supposedly ran right after he rebuilt it over a winter. I would spend $50 unflinching for a conversion system, I don't know if I'd cough up $200. Anyone know of a fix for the block wear. I thought about reaming it and trying to get an oversise rod made. I don't want to have to disassemble the motor just to fis this, though. Thanks for all the feedback and suggestion. Good luck to all of Youse Guys bobjack

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Guest
Been there too. My 620 was missing like that and losing power a few years ago, ended up that the plunger that actuates the points had worn at an angle. Turned it over and it was fine for 6 mos. to a year, but ended up having to replace it. Only $4-5. Couple years later I rebuilt my CCKB, new points and all. After 50 hours, I went through the same headache you did. I cleaned and filed, etc, not much difference. Put in a new set of points and it hasn't missed a beat yet. Good luck.

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JeffG
Bobjack, You can replace the brass bushing in the bottom of the points box (where the rod goes through) and replace the gasket under the points box. Take the points box out and see if the bottom of the box is warped badly. If it is - it may require a new box. The points box gets warped from excessive heat - usually the result of not having the heat shield in place. Another thing is to make sure the points are tight and cannot move after they are gapped. Replace the condenser. Also, make sure your crankcase breather mesh is clean and the breather hose is not plugged or anything. What about the timing? Plugs? Got good gas in it? Fuel filter? Fuel pump leaking? Have you rebuilt the carb. lately? Float level adjusted properly (also check to make sure the float has not developed a leak and taking on fuel)? Just grabbing at straws (from previous experiences) in an attempt to help. Good luck. Jeff

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bobjack
Hey Jeffg, My engine is a 18 Horse Kohler OHV, cast iron block. No points box or brass bushing. The act. rod just runs thru a hole in the side of the cast iron block and the points mount right on the block over the act. rod hole. I think you are describing an Onan setup -- sorry for the confusion -- I posted my orig. reply (to poster bgin who has a CCKA Onan) because of similar problem on different motor. Been thru all the things that you have mentioned except crankcase breather. I haven't checked fuel pressure from pump yet. After I get new act. rod installed and slow down the oil to points problem and get new gaskets for crankcase breather to check it, I update again. As a note of interest, I did find insturctions to put a crank trigger and Chrysler ign. module on a small engine to eliminate points. The magnetic trigger costa about $80 and electronic module is probably 30 to 60. Then you have to make an aluminum disk and hub to run on the crank snout to trigger it. Also MSD does make a capacitive discharge ign. system to work with points for $80 which just uses the points for a trigger, rather than a current carrying device. Oiled points may still defeat it though. bobjack

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bobjack
UP-DATE on my ignition problems Got a new point actuating rod for my 7018 (Kohler 18 HP OHV and installed it. Got to thinking about the points again and something clicked. Metered the coil (Marked 12V) and found a resistance of only about 1.6 ohms -- book says it should be closer to 3 or 4 ohms. I filed the 2 hour old and "burnt black point contacts" and installed a ballast resistor, and VOILA -- runs great now. I have about 9 hrs running on it since the ballast resistor was installed and it still runs great. The coil apparantly was replaced by previous owner with a non-Kohler unit marked 12V which was assumed to have the ballast resistor built in -- Sure caused me tons-o-grief. bobjack

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