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jsarro

How to repair Hydro leak?

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jsarro
I have been considering buying a 3416H. I did a search for repair options on a leaky Vicker's hydro but did not come up with much. The one I'm looking at has what I believe to be the typical leak in the rear. Something to do with a shaft and or O ring. Does anyone know what is involved with this type of problem and potential time, labor, and expense fixing? Once it is fixed for how long will it stay fixed? The seller says he adds a half dixy cup of fluid after every 3 uses or so.

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rfsmith1952
Well, the seals aren't so hard to do, but you do need to get in there pretty deep. I have a Homelite T-12 (Equiv to allis built 3415H) You can do it the long, slow, thorough way and disassemble everything [many hours, much labor, some money] (I did that, had fun, learned a lot, but ultimately did not solve the problem) Or you can just swap the back half of the tractor out. [four hours, not counting the overnite trip across three states to get the other back end](I did that too, on the same tractor; problem solved!) It's a fairly straightforward operation. I did not replace the seals, and they do leak. But the tractor runs well, works well and I believe will hold up. In other words, it is a candidate for restoration, including the seals) So ask yourself: Is this a worker or is this a showpiece? or somewhere in between? Is half a dixie cup once a month too much to bear? One thing is sure, these guys have the knowledge, and experience, and they are willing to part with it. So if you decide to dive in, don't worry if you get lost, they'll get you back. Sorry for the length of this, I'm usually much more brief. This is a "Mystic" answer:D:D8D

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jsarro
quote:
Originally posted by rfsmith1952
One thing is sure, these guys have the knowledge, and experience, and they are willing to part with it. So if you decide to dive in, don't worry if you get lost, they'll get you back. Sorry for the length of this, I'm usually much more brief. This is a "Mystic" answer:D:D8D
Thank you for your response!dOd Good story of your endeavors to fix your tractor. This club is awesome! The experience people have and share here is invaluable. Having said that, your experience brings it to home. I don't mind having a worker, but I would like to be able to keep it clean. Good perspective. Thanks

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MysTiK
quote:
Originally posted by rfsmith1952
Well, the seals aren't so hard to do, but you do need to get in there pretty deep. I have a Homelite T-12 (Equiv to allis built 3415H) You can do it the long, slow, thorough way and disassemble everything [many hours, much labor, some money] (I did that, had fun, learned a lot, but ultimately did not solve the problem) Or you can just swap the back half of the tractor out. [four hours, not counting the overnite trip across three states to get the other back end](I did that too, on the same tractor; problem solved!) It's a fairly straightforward operation. I did not replace the seals, and they do leak. But the tractor runs well, works well and I believe will hold up. In other words, it is a candidate for restoration, including the seals) So ask yourself: Is this a worker or is this a showpiece? or somewhere in between? Is half a dixie cup once a month too much to bear? One thing is sure, these guys have the knowledge, and experience, and they are willing to part with it. So if you decide to dive in, don't worry if you get lost, they'll get you back. Sorry for the length of this, I'm usually much more brief. This is a "Mystic" answer:D:D8D
I HEARD THAT. sm04 Excellent post - nothing like sharing real live experience. A pleasure to read, it drew me right in there with you, and it kinda paints a great picture - worth a thousand words; but that would be a MysTiK answer. yell. cheers. I wasn't expecting anything.... sm03

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JimDk
Our Vickers equipped tractors DO NOT LEAK. They are marking their territory. A 18" chunk of cardboard under their belly makes them happy, and protects your floor.:D:D By the way, Bob, your 3 state trip could have been an hour or two longer if you had stopped for that lunch that I owe you.$

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jbird243
I have a 3416H that was leaking bad at the back of the unit. The shaft was worn-ed into the shaft hole. A new seal would not repair it. I put a cap on a copper pipe to completely enclosed the protruding shaft and lightly tapped pipe into the hole. I also ground a tapper on the end of the pipe so it would fit the hole. The fit was not perfect because of the wear on the hole. I then installed a large band clamp with metal screw to the cap of the pipe and around the hydro unit. I tightened the clamp to hold the capped copper pipe in the shaft hole. I also brushed plastic epoxy from West Marine to fill any cracks the pipe did not fill. This repair has worked for the present. Jay

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ReedS
The dreaded Vickers pintle shaft leak is best repaired by having the housing bushed which requires disassembly and machine work. Though I don't know this for a fact I was under the impression that Sandy Lake Implement may have a housing or 2 that have been repaired and ready to go, but like I said that was some time ago. As mentioned swapping a non-leaking rear end is also another option.

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PhanDad
Here's a couple posts on leaking pintle shafts: http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=115943&SearchTerms=pintle http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=112048&SearchTerms=pintle Others above talk about leaking seals, they are much easier to fix; the pintleshaft is the hard/expensive one. I live with a leaking pintle shaft on my Homelite T12, no effect on performance, you just have to add Dexron every so often and keep something under the tractor (I use a piece of vinyl flooring material with a piece of old rug on it for adsorption) to collect the drips.

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MysTiK
If I liked the tractor, and it was a great deal by itself, was in good shape, ran well on a prolonged test drive, and seemed to work well, and had a parts tractor to boot - let it drip into it's own lil potty. sm01. Price? 200-400 plain jane. Add Attachs. Oops, that'll cause a stir. 8) Mine was a deal like that - had to buy parts tractor to get what was missing on the first - like everything. I got lucky. But they are all messy somehow or other, even brand new. Otherwise we would keep them in our living rooms, cos the seats are comfy and they are cute. Keep doing the research, cos then when your deal appears, you are ready, and you know it. It's personal. And the chips fall no matter what. Warranty is really expensive. Peace of mind is priceless. Nobody is alone.

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rfsmith1952
I like Jim's answer...they don't leak, they are marking their territory! He knows his stuff. Jim found my T-12 for "Free" It was winter, Jim lives up by the mistake by the lake (Erie) and the tractor was in SE PA, closer to me. He convinced me that the only honorable thing to do was rescue it from the scrap heap. Now, a year or so later, I am the shift shaft neutral/drive lever expert. @Jack: Both Jim and Bill (Phandad) are very good with that model, and they will surely help. Have fun, that's why I do it.

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jsarro
quote:
Originally posted by jbird243
I have a 3416H that was leaking bad at the back of the unit. The shaft was worn-ed into the shaft hole. A new seal would not repair it. I put a cap on a copper pipe to completely enclosed the protruding shaft and lightly tapped pipe into the hole. Jay
Creative fix!

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jsarro
quote:
Originally posted by PhanDad
Here's a couple posts on leaking pintle shafts: http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=115943&SearchTerms=pintle http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=112048&SearchTerms=pintle Others above talk about leaking seals, they are much easier to fix; the pintleshaft is the hard/expensive one.
Awesome post, thanks for the links. I called Sandy Lake Implement. They sell the bushed housing to accept the pintle shaft for $165.00. You send them back the housing core. They keep a few bushed on hand. Has anyone done this job and it been long term successful?

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jsarro
quote:
Originally posted by MysTiK
If I liked the tractor, and it was a great deal by itself, was in good shape, ran well on a prolonged test drive, and seemed to work well, and had a parts tractor to boot - let it drip into it's own lil potty. sm01. Price? 200-400 plain jane. Add Attachs. Oops, that'll cause a stir. 8)
Do you think $450.00 for the two tractors is ball park given the main one has a known hydro leak and is in fair to good condition cosmetically? Mechanically otherwise is suppose to be top notch. The parts tractor has a bad attempted repaint, is missing the seat, and a drive shaft rod of some sort. Otherwise has the full motor and hydro on board? It comes with one 48" deck.

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rfsmith1952
I think the pintle is in the hydro/pump/motor unit. I think it is the end opposite the control arm shaft. Here's a diagram from the vickers repair manual. Buy some dixie cups.:)


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RayS
Sandy Lake Implement used to sell rebushed cases. Not sure if they still do or not. Used to be $130 I believe and you sent them your old one. That is if my memory serves me correctly. The two 3416H`s that I had in the past had bushings and didn`t leak. Not sure if that was factory or someone was willing to spend the time and money. I thought that they came that way from the factory on them, but may be wrong. I like the smoother operation of the Vickers. The downside is the leaking pintle shaft. My HB212 didn't leak until I bragged about it a couple of times and it didn't take me long to switch it over to a Sundstrand. I like the looks of the old tractors but love the ease of maintenance on the 7000 - 7100 series tractors. I like the fact that you can crawl under them and change a hose, hydraulic cylinder, coupling disk, or what have you without having to disassemble the tractor to get to what needs replaced.

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RayS
quote:
Originally posted by jsarro
On the schematic below, what are the main parts involved with the pintle shaft repair. i do not see anything labeled pintle shaft.
[img]/club2/attach/jsarro/3416HYDRO.jpg[/img]

I have the repair manual for the Vickers if you are interested send an email address in a PM and I will send it to you or whoever else wants a copy.

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jsarro
quote:
Originally posted by rfsmith1952
I think the pintle is in the hydro/pump/motor unit. I think it is the end opposite the control arm shaft. Here's a diagram from the vickers repair manual. Buy some dixie cups.:)
Awesome diagram. I understand it now, it is very helpful to have the picture in your minds eye. Thank you!sm01

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jsarro
quote:
Originally posted by RayS
Sandy Lake Implement used to sell rebushed cases. Not sure if they still do or not. Used to be $130 I believe and you sent them your old one. That is if my memory serves me correctly. The two 3416H`s that I had in the past had bushings and didn`t leak. Not sure if that was factory or someone was willing to spend the time and money. I thought that they came that way from the factory on them, but may be wrong.
Yes I spoke with Sandy Lake today. It now costs $165.00 for the refurbished housing outfitted with the bushing. They said they have been fixing these for 15 yrs. and have yet to see them leak again. I wonder if the bushing is made of steel and will not wear like the cast iron housing, therefore preventing it from coming back? Your must have already been fixed B4 you bought them. Yeah!

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jsarro
quote:
Originally posted by RayS
[quote][i] I have the repair manual for the Vickers if you are interested send an email address in a PM and I will send it to you or whoever else wants a copy.
Ray you are a class act, that manual is awesome! dOd Thank you for your consideration!

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RayS
Just trying to help. Not sure what material they use but the ones I have seen looked like bronze. I had a nice one a couple years ago in a parts tractor I bought and when I was offered $350 for the pump it was a little hard to refuse.

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rfsmith1952
There you go..in just a few hours you learned what was most likely wrong, and how to fix it. Ray has everything and anything you may need. He's a good source for parts too. He is reasonable and fair. BTW a pump overhaul can be as much as $400. I have a dead one here I'm going to take apart when it gets too cold to go out and play:D I have heard stories that they just need a cleaning and some O-rings you can get at Lowe's. I think not, but we'll see.

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