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Bell

712 vs 314

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Bell
I have an AC 712h and have been looking at a 314H. I was wondering if th 314 is a bigger or more capable tractor (other than the 2 HP). Grass is always greener, you know. In adition to that question when do they stop being considered lawn tractors and start being garden? I.E. is the 712 lawn or garden? The 314?

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Kent
Garden tractors are technically any that can use ground engaging implements like a plow or tiller (not counting the towed tillers with their own engine). Both those are considered garden tractors... As a quick and dirty method of identifying them, those that have bolt on rear wheels typically are garden tractors, while the lawn tractors use keyed hubs in the wheel. The 3xx series are a heavier tractor, so they might provide a bit more traction, stock. However, parts for them can be a real challenge as many/most are no longer available...

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MysTiK
I asked the same question when it all began for me - and I followed Kent's rule of thumb - look for the 5 bolts on the rear wheel, altho there could be 4 or 5 or whatever - the wheel is held on strong and made for pulling torque forces. But it's not just the wheel, or rim, there's more serious mechanical parts beyond that. Have a look at a real garden tractor. Drive one if you can. Then look at a cheap LT lawn tractor, again not just at the rear wheel, look at the elastic bands and bubble gum that hold it together. If you use an LT for serious pulling, it might do it - but generally you are risking busting the transmission out of it. When I bought my 716H, essentially identical to a 712, just horsey power - I had the thing idling on my trailer, and it was slightly engage by the hydro in slight reverse. It was sitting jamming itself against one end of the trailer, and spinning the back wheels very slowly, at idle. They are very different to LT's. When I first drove it, as an unknowing nooby (not much has changed), I knew that it was a little tractor that had the heart of a full sized farm tractor - slight exaggeration there - but I knew my new toy was not some simple little machine. It crawled up to hill in my yard and then crawled up the hill, low engine speed. An LT would require a run at the same hill. It's more about the transmission, traction, weight, and serious built-in tough stuff that's built to last and work hard. The common riding mowers are built to mow; to make them pull is to wear them down quickly; they are not made for the real hard work. Traction is often the only limitation - I had mine hooked to a tree; but it couldn't pull the tree over cos the tires were spinning. o well. There's also AG tires, chains, wheel weights, etc. to force the issue - traction is a biggy. Your tractor can do anything my tractor can do. The Sundstrand trans in either is identical. As long as that tranny pump is spinning, yours will do what mine will do - it is not about horsepower at all. But horsepower comes into play for running pto attached snowblowers, etc. etc. I simply have 4 hp on reserve - but it will probably never come down to that being a difference either. Either of our tractors are great parts tractors for the other - almost identical. and you can look back in time or forward in time to related models, and see a lot of similarity more than differences - in some cases, parts interchangeable, but not always - the 900series is very close (aka 7000 and 7100series Simps). hope that helps. Welcome to the club. sm01 Graham .

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SmilinSam
I've had both a 712H and a 314H running and working at one time or another( along with about everything inbetween , above and below:D) , and I'd say unless the 314 appeals to you as a collectors item, I'd personally stick with the 712 to use as a workhorse. The 314 and 416 types were only made for about 4 years, the vickers trannies in them were last made around 1974. The 300 series also had different attachments hitch spacings, only giving you a couple years of attachments that will fit without mods being made either to the tractor or attachments. The 712 uses a sundstrand tranny that was made and used in Soveriegns from 1975 clear up to the year 2000. Most of the rest of the tractor parts are in the same time frame. Thats 25 years of spare parts and attachments interchangability.dOd Both tractors are the same sort of class, with , as Kent stated, the 314 being a little heavier weightwise.

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maxtorman1234
I've had many of the 300's and 700's among many others, And I do find that pulling and traction is better with the 300's for sure, front axle bushings are common wear point, and the steering gearboxes, which can be fairly expensive. Other than than, if the vickers transmission isn't leaking, There's not much else to go wrong. I find the shallow deck on the 3/4's is better for mowing long grass. However on the 700's you don't have to worry about pretty much any of those wear points mentioned above. But I do find my 300 nicer to use, and steer, and is my favourite machine following my Ultima.

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leeave96
I saw some mighty fine looking 300 and 400 series tractors at Mack's place when I was out there several weeks ago. I liked them - heavy duty garden tractors. From time to time I see them come up for sale around my neck of the woods. I'd buy one. FWIW, my definition of a garden tractor is one that is designed to take a sleeve or three point hitch and capable of pulling a moldboard plow without damage. I see a lot of near garden tractors that are fine for probably 99% of users. Tilling, pulling a cart full of firewood, pushing some snow or dirt with a front blade. What they won't do is moldboard plowing. My Dad has a Prestige and it has a mighty fine K71 tranny in it. I don't know if I would use it in a moldboard plow application. It certainly is not built as heavy (IMHO) as my Agco-Allis/Sovereign 918H or my Wheelhorse and IH Cub Cadet garden tractors. But the power steering is nice .... :D My advice is to keep your 712H and buy the 314H to go along side it. Good luck, Bill

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sammiefish
for mowing, blowing, plowing or just about any ground engaging exercise, you will notice a difference with the additional horsepower. Im working on a 314H now but haven't used it yet but I also have a 10, 12 and 16 Hp in the 3 and 400 series. there is a difference between all of them when mowing knee high grass or blowing feet of snow... they all do the work but the ground speed must be varied accordingly.... big surprise I'm sure... but you said that was not your concern... If you look up your parts etc. you will find the 3 and 400 series listed under allis chalmers lawn tractors, don't be fooled, the 3/400's are every bit a garden tractor

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Mack
quote:
I saw some mighty fine looking 300 and 400 series tractors at Mack's place when I was out there several weeks ago. I liked them - heavy duty garden tractors.
:D Thanks, Bill. I have about a dozen 3/400 machines in various condition and a lot of the 3/400 specific attachments. It has taken years to find some of these. The 314H would have been the "top of the line" machine in 1971 but will be harder to find attachments for now. The 712H will be much easier to find parts & attachments for and likely a better choice for you. BTW, Seth, the 700 series tractors were introduced in 1974 so your 712H is a few years younger than you think.

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