Jump to content

Unofficial Home of Old Simplicity & Allis-Chalmers Garden Tractors

Sign in to follow this  
PhanDad

Simplicity Belts - Different Now

Recommended Posts

PhanDad
There's always a debate on whether non Simplicity belts as as good as Simplicity belts. Up to now, I've been a believer in Simplicity belts, but that may change. Here's some more fuel for the debate. I just picked up a new 144" mid PTO snowblower belt. It doesn't have the usual outer covering (casing?) that's a bit rough. Here's a few pics of the new belt:






In the pics, you really can't see what it looks like as you can with your eye. It looks like the casing was replaced with a "dimpling" or pattern stamped into the belt. Or it could be that the old style covering is now coated with something but I don't think so. All surfaces of the new belt are definitely more slippery than the older covered belts. I don't think that's a good thing. For reference, here's a couple of pics of the older covered belts:




The above is one of the newer "reddish" covered belts rather than the older grey covered belts. I didn't see any usage difference between the grey vs reddish covered belts. Anyone else have this "new" style of Simplicity belt? Maybe it's only the long snowblower belt that's made this new way? Only use will tell how well it holds up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
GregB
Welcome to big company mentality. Purchasing gets someone else to make the belts a little cheaper. Purchasing guy gets "at a boys" for cost savings. Belts do not last as long. Sales sells more belts because of that fact. Sales guy gets "at a boys" for more belt sales. Repeat till product bad enough for customer to go elsewhere. When your company closes down due to lack of sales, get job elsewhere. Repeat pattern, over and over and over....... Rant over }:) My two cents, value accordingly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
BLT
quote:
Originally posted by GregB
Welcome to big company mentality. Purchasing gets someone else to make the belts a little cheaper. Purchasing guy gets "at a boys" for cost savings. Belts do not last as long. Sales sells more belts because of that fact. Sales guy gets "at a boys" for more belt sales. Repeat till product bad enough for customer to go elsewhere. When your company closes down due to lack of sales, get job elsewhere. Repeat pattern, over and over and over....... Rant over }:) My two cents, value accordingly.
Sudden increase in warranty payments to that particular belt number because of an increase of premature failures. Warranty department rags on purchasing. Purchasing points to engineering claiming the set the spec. Engineering samples some sample belts and after failures, dissects a sample belt or two to see what they are made of. Surprisingly belt is not made to the standard that has been set, and notifys belt manufacturer. Manufacturer gives engineering the spec that the belt people gave to them. Not up to standard that engineering called for and the director of purchasing is told to hight the highway.:D Been therre saw that!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Multiplicity
When you are taking "Close Up" Photos like with the belts, turn you camera selector to the "Macro-Mode" (a flower icon) for close in shots....It's a setting that lets it focus better....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
GregB
Yea Bob, seen that too. But I doubt the the newer tractors use the same belt numbers, that we do on our series of tractors. No warranty dept oversight. Belts alone are probably considered a "consumable" for older tractors. Greg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
jsarro
Greg and Bob, You guys seem to have nailed it. I enjoyed the commentary.:D PhanDad, It looks pretty clear from your pictures that they removed the fabric coating that adds to the quality of the belt? The fabric helps prevent slippage and probably adds strength? Has anyone checked out those NAPA belts? Several members seemed pretty high on those belts. I am going to look into those.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
dentwizz
I have seen plenty of the all black no jacket type belts last in strained applications for a while. The jacket type seems to tolerate lower tension better, but the advantage of the black ones is seemingly less appearance of wear depending on the quality of the rubber used(not all are equal obviously).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
BLT
Each manufacturer has their own finish wrap for the the belts they furnish. NAPA uses Gates for both their green line "L" and the "A" & "B" black finish. I have a couple of the gray finish Simplicity belts and no problem so far.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MrSteele
I have been using a kevlar belt, made in India for a while, got my mom and pop store to order them and sent everyone I know to their store for lawnmower belts. I have no idea of the brand, but the deck belt that is on my Landlord has been there for around 4 years with no problems at all. (Murphy's gonna get me for that comment). Even an older Simplicity belt didn't last that long. I got 2 complete sets of belts on the first order, still not used the second set.Both sets of belts and shipping were cheaper than one Simplicity deck belt. Gates and Dayco make a better than you buy at most stores belt. They cost more, Gates is green, Dayco has a gray cover, the last one I bought, anyway. Neither as good as the Indian made kevlar. I'll go to the shop in the morning and look for a brand name. I think they can be bought online, now

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
GrincheyOne
I recently saw both eBay and Amazon offering Kevlar belts for the S/G @ or around $18. I don't know haow you feel about either of these sources, but if I am going to the trouble of detaching the drive shaft to replace a belt, I am certainly going to opt for the one with the kevlar cords. I'm sure my knuckles will thank me for the choice.;) Wayne

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
dentwizz
Actually the S/G belt is the least stress of any on the unit. Any automotive grade belt should tolerate that for decades since it does not have any twists or particularly tight bends.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
powerking_one
I agree with Joe/others about the PIX mfg line of Kevlar belts made in India (the TSC brand of Huskie); they are very good. I've been running a few of them on my machines for a few years now and no problems. Also, the in store stock at TSC has just about every size we need for our Simplicity tractors and they are less than the Sten's or other brand's of aftermarket ones when using jackssmallengines.com parts database for price reference. Tom(PK)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JeffNemes
I believe Simplicity belts that are not black in color are made with the Kevlar cords - includes white, tan, brown. They have been in use more than 10 years for certain applications. Originally claimed not to shrink or stretch.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1Litre
The fiber cover is actually canvas. The Kevlar is inside near the top and is braided strands like wire rope . Most 1/2" belts will have four or five strands in its cross section . Browning was a supplier to Simplicity for belts and some pulleys in the past. I worked for a Case dealer that sold the Case/Ingersoll garden tractors and most belts they provided was of the unwrapped construction. Looked like a fan belt for a car just larger cross section . You see the cords on the sides of the belt,junk is what I would think ,right? No , those belts worked and when we could not get our orders filled from Ingersoll we searched and searched but could not find a belt that would last. Green Gates belt,15 min. if that when it rolled over. A series Goodyears better but would just fail mostly on the first cutting. . The boss would not let me cross to Simplicity belts and test them out. We will never know .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JohnFornaro
I've used the green belts from NAPA for a while with good results. I measure the existing belt with a string, and order the NAPA one by length. Often I'll buy two. Current problem is I've got twenty or thiry belts, and am not completely sure what I got. Also, I've bumped up the belt width with good sussess too. Going from a 7/16" belt to a 1/2" belt, for example.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
dennmill
I would like to know what standard belts to substitute for the drive belts on the 6216 tractor -- the 1669937 and 1669394. I've been told that these belts are 54 and 50 inches long which would be equivalent to B51 and B47 belts respectively. Can anyone confirm the lengths of these belts for me? On my 6216 tractor I have substituted standard A120 belts for my 42 inch mower deck and they have held up at least as well as the Simplicity belts. So based on that experience I'm going for substitute belts across the board that are more readily available and at a much lower price. Thanks for any info, especially belt lengths.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
PhanDad
Go here: http://www.jackssmallengines.com/simplicity_lawnmower_parts_index.cfm Put in the Simplicity part number and you'll find the info on the belt. The first one listed is a 5L belt, 54" long.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1Litre
A , B etc... belts are measured from the inside (bottom) of the v and L series are from the outside . Keep that in mind when crossing belts. Example 4L56 1/2" wide is 56in. around the top and an equal length A series 1/2" wide is marked A54 for the inside measurement. The bigger the cross section of the belt the larger the difference will be.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this  

×