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mtoney

What to do with the B1's ailing engine

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mtoney
I pulled the head on my B1 this afternoon, its been smoking like a steam engine since I got it running again. The top of the piston was clean, no carbon, very little carbon around the valves and even the head itself had no carbon, but lots of liquid oil. The bore is clean, no scorring or gouges in the wall. I dont have means here at home to Mic the bore. Piston is tight in the bore at the bottom, does have a little side to side movement at TDC. There was a nice mouse next packed in the shroud, looks to have been there awhile. I am wondering with the lack of carbon, it was run with the nest at one time and overheated, causing the rings to loose thier temper and causing the massive oil burning. She doesnt knock or any other strange noises, just smokes bad! SO, the question is do I just hone it good and rering and see how she does or drop in a repower from SEW. The motor isnt original thats in there, so keeping or replacing it doesnt really matter. The cost localy to fully overhaul would exceed what I could get the repower kit for. I would sell the engine(23A 9hp) to help recoup some of the new engine costs. Any suggestions? Or anybody wanna come over and help tear into this old girl with me? Mike

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mtoney
Here is the repower I would be considering if I replace the engine. Have to get the rest of my attachments paid off first though. Mike http://www.ebay.com/itm/11hp-Briggs-Stratton-Engine-Industrial-Plus-Allis-Chalmers-B10-256422-AC-B10-T-/130759975722?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e71e6e32a

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mtoney
OK, I will pull it and check it, anything specific to look for? The older cast briggs is something in 10 years as a small engine mechanic I have never had to work on. Just the newer stuff and K series Kohlers. Mike

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BLT
It appears that the breather just screws on the block. Try disconnecting the connecting hose from the air cleaner pipe and then run it and see what goes on at the hose end. If the breather is plugged, your smoking should subside, and you might have oil dripping out of hose. Then your next adventure will be to clean the breather. Don't forget to tape off hole in air intake tube.

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mtoney
This engine doenst vent to the air intake, in fact, the plate which looks to be original to the motor, has no visable way to vent at all, atleast when I look at it behind the carb. Just a bolt head in the center of the plate, nothing else like a vent hole or port like a K series Kohler has. Never seen one that doesnt have a vent port of some kind, either to open air or back into the carb intake body. Mike

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mtoney
This one has the vent/breather on the right side of the motor near the grill when sitting on the tractor. Just vents to atomsphere instead of to the intake. I will pull it tomorrow and clean it and see what happens. I know where I can get a drop in replacement from a member here, just cannot afford it right now. It would be a better option than what SEW offers. If anybody is interested in this 23a engine, shoot me a PM with an offer ect. Depending on what I might get offered, I might just repower with the cheaper SEW engine for now.

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mtoney
I pulled the breather valve, kind of a circular thing that screws into the top of the crankcase and has a rubber tube that just tucks into the curved cylinder tin work, blowing any fumes toward the exhaust side of the tractor. The rubber tube was bone dry, would expect more oily residue with the amount of smoking its doing. The little cannister that screws in looks to have a fiber material inside it, very gooey and yucky inside, so I put that part, without the rubber tube in my carb soaker can, let it work on it for an hour or so. See if it flushes out the crap. Mike

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BLT
The smoking comes from the oil being pushed up thru the valve stems as the crankcase pressure balance has been compromised and oil has no where else to go. Try screwing just an elbow and a chunk of hose in the vent hole and run the engine under load and see if your smoking subsides. You can the see how heavy the oil mist is then.

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mtoney
I had to go up to Maple Grove Distributors today to order a carb for another rider I am fixing for someone. Found out the rings for the 23A are NLA now from Briggs, showed available 2 weeks ago, but they just did a update and now they dont have them anymore. So, I guess that leaves me with repowering now. I did clean the breather, that helps at full power, little to no smoke at full bore but still smoking good when I throttle down or at idle. Mike

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mtoney
I have the mower deck under her, need the 2 belts and I can cut grass this week with it. A good load for an hour or so mowing will tell if the engine is going to quit smoking or not. I prefer to keep it with the cast iron engine. I know where I can get a NOS 10hp cast iron one for $750, just dont have that kind of coin right now. Mike

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MysTiK
Never mind that; the oil will clear up soon enough, or good enough. Rings maybe.? Mine 716 had black oil - took 3 changes to rid the black - and it smoked idle, but eventually became minimal. Now it only shows if idle for 1/2 minute - but just a puff and gone. I think the idle is set too low. Raising idle might make it vanish. Overall oil consumption is no big deal. I don't really know why it only does it on idle tho - don't understand that. Allis manual calls for 1700-1800 idle speed - I'm probably at 1000 - too low for hydro - but I bump it up before driving. I'm also due for an oil change, oil going dark - and it seems to smoke more last week or so - guess it likes clean. Is that vent hose permanent or temporary. My Honda 500 thumper dirt bike had a breather exit out the bottom like that - oil mist, rubber hose hanging down. It hardly used oil also. Ran 20w50 in that one. It used to rattle the cam when grunting low in 2nd - or 3rd, like you mentioned in the other thread - I had forgotten about that. (good point - the Kohler is that same sound. 8D - it never was piston rattle - the Honda did that from new).

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mtoney
When I was puttering around at Portland at idle or just above idle, I could watch the oil smoke and once and awhile it would quit for 4 or 5 cycles, then it would return. So I am hopefull that once I work the engine, the rings will free up and seat. It has a newer head gasget in it and the cylinder had a cross hatch pattern, so I wonder if it was gone thru recently, then left to sit and the rings stuck or never seated properly. Its hard to tell, Muggsie never ran it and it wasnt running when he got it. I am going to hopefully get belts today and mow. Mike

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Chris727
For 32" mower deck: Arbor Drive belt = 63.1" x 1/2" Mid-Pto to deck= 48.1" x 1/2" BGB to mid-PTO= 35" x 1/2" Technically they are 11/32" belts but I don't think they have them at Rural King. I would suggest you get at least kevlar belts, some of the farm store belts are simply fractional horsepower belts and will not hold up to use on lawn equipment.

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mtoney
I got the best ones Rural King had, greenish blue fabric covered, not the cheaper black rubber ones. Since this is a bit of a test, didnt wanna drop to much. I got a 45" for the mid PTO to mower deck, a 48" would have been way to long. As it is now, running on the smaller of the 2 pulleys on the mid pto, it just barely rubs the cross bar for the rear roller. If I put it on the bigger pulley on the mid pto, it really rubs that bar hard, almost looks like it needs to go under that cross bar for one side of the belt. I should have took pics of the B1 with the 32" under it up at the show in Peru and I didnt. I am wondering if the true B1 32" mower deck had a dip in the cross bar on the rear, my deck is off a verticle shaft motor broadmoor that was the same color at the B1(or close to it) I did have to adapt the front mounting arms as they were to narrow being for the other model tractor. It drives the mower alright but the deck is currently set to low for my mower style. The adjuster/screw shaft was froze and the PO broke it. Trying to find my spare so I can raise the deck to 2 1/4 inch mowing height that my customers want me to mow at. The 35" for the BGB to Mid PTO was perfect. The spindle drive belt is in good shape. Just have to work on the mid to mower deck rubbing issue. If anybody has a pic of a B1 with a 32" mower on it that I can see the belt arrangement ect. Please post it. Thanks MIke

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mtoney
I figured that Ray, from the pics I have seen, but that isnt going to work at the moment, the belt really drags hard on the crossbar for the rear roller if the belt is on that pulley, using a 45" belt. Thats why I wish that I had taken pics of that b1 with the 32 on it since it was new. See if there were differances between my deck and that one. The blades do spin nice and put out some good air flow on the smaller pulley though. Mike

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mtoney
Pics of the belt rubbing. The twist is correct for the blade rotation, deck is a left hand discharge. Belt rubs the bracket plate for the lift chain and the bar that goes side to side for the rear roller. Putting the belt on the larger mid PTO pulley makes the matter worse. Is it because its a B1? I read somewhere that the pto on the B10 is higher up to give better belt clearance. Would this deck work better on a B10 or would the B10's mid pto change the belt clearance issues? [IMG]http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j285/cadetpwr/forsalepics030.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j285/cadetpwr/forsalepics029.jpg[/IMG]

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mtoney
I have come to accept this deck ISNT going to work on this tractor in its current form. The front of the deck wont go above 1 3/4 inch so it scalps bad. The linkages to the rear roller and front arms are incorrect for the B series. I am so ticked at the whole thing I am about ready to load it up for scrap. I need a mowing tractor and this obviously isnt it right now. I cant use the normal 42" deck, thats to wide for my and one of my other yards, but those yards are also to large to just push mow. I am open to suggestions or trade/cash offers, then I could pay off the tiller and parts to Muggsie and find something I can mow with.

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