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FlashandFlare

question reguarding Simplicity dealers

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FlashandFlare
Did I miss a memo ? Is it now common practice for a Simplicity dealer to charge the consumer shipping on OEM Simplicity parts ? Not next day air charges, not express shipping charges, just normal shipping for parts that are quite common and used widely across the Simplicity brand. Thanks F&F

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steve-wis
Not sure, but I believe it started with the Briggs buyout. Someone correct me if I am wrong. I have found that the prices with the shipping, from my dealer, are still very competitive with online sources most of the time. Steve

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FlashandFlare
quote:
Originally posted by steve-wis
Not sure, but I believe it started with the Briggs buyout. Someone correct me if I am wrong. I have found that the prices with the shipping, from my dealer, are still very competitive with online sources most of the time. Steve
So you believe adding shipping charges to there own OEM parts is now the norm ? I have been buying recreational and powersports parts and accessories for 25yrs and I have never ever been charged shipping on OEM parts that were purchased at the respective dealer. I have paid extra for "next day" "air" "express" shipping and I have paid shipping on aftermarket items, but not on OEM. This topic was started today based on an experience I had a Authorized Simplicity dealer that I stopped at on my way home from work last night. I wanted to order 7 items, 6 of which were tiny enough to fit in the palm of your hand. The 7th item was a shaft that was .75dia x 18" long, that was the only odd ball and this dealer said that there was an additional $18 for shipping on these items.

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Chris727
I work for a Deere dealer and you won't pay any shipping for John Deere stock order parts. John Deere doesn't charge the dealer for this service. I can emergency parts for the next day (before 3pm cutoff) and charge only $8.50 for the first 3 pounds. You won't find that with other OEMs. Other products are another story. With short lines there is always a freight charge and you have to pass it along. With Simplicity dealers, I imagine B&S is charging them freight but the idea is that when you're moving enough parts you can stock order other parts your running out of and not charge freight to the one or two customers who special order something. What aggravates me is when I ask for a part to be stock ordered and it still takes a month to arrive (could be due to backorders), and theres still a freight charge.

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GregB
My local "stocking" simplicity dealer has been charging me shipping for 3-4 years. Well he has been trying to. When he says shipping, I say are you sure , I can order it over the internet cheaper. He has always lost the sale Maybe it is up to the dealership? Or just another way to squeeze out another couple of dollars.

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PhanDad
My local dealer is upfront with me. If I want the part NOW, then I pay shipping (unless it's a big $$$ order). If I "order" the part with him, he waits and groups my parts with other "orders" and his stock replenishment until the total $$ of parts is over some amount such that Briggs doesn't charge him shipping. If he doesn't pay shipping, I don't pay shipping.

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FlashandFlare
quote:
Originally posted by Chris727
Lets all bear in mind, some of these dealers are Mom and Pop stores that are barely surviving as it is, they need to make what $$ they can.
I really hope this is sarcasm, because if it's not................then were does the line get drawn ? Along with shipping they should start charging for the use of the lights when I am looking at there inventory, or the kilowatts used to power the cash register so they can bend me over some more.

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FlashandFlare
quote:
Originally posted by PhanDad
My local dealer is upfront with me. If I want the part NOW, then I pay shipping (unless it's a big $$$ order). If I "order" the part with him, he waits and groups my parts with other "orders" and his stock replenishment until the total $$ of parts is over some amount such that Briggs doesn't charge him shipping. If he doesn't pay shipping, I don't pay shipping.
I specifically told him I was in no hurry since there was no snow on the ground yet and that he could wait to order these parts with the rest of his OEM parts and he said the $18 charge still applies. Sucks that I can order parts from across the nation and get free shipping, but I can't support my semi-local dealer 19 miles away without getting violated.

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FlashandFlare
quote:
Originally posted by steve-wis
Maybe I missed the question. Thought it was when they started to charge for shipping. Sorry if I misunderstood.
No, you understood my rambling correct. I still think its that the dealer I went to was tacking $18 onto the total for shipping the tiny items I wanted to buy, even after I told him there was to hurry and to order with rest of his OEM stuff.

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Chris727
I guess you mis-interpreted my statement. I just meant that I'm happy to pay a little bit more when necessary to keep local people working, maybe not $18 more, but maybe $10 more. The internet and box stores are killing these businesses. They buy in such large volumes that they can discount the parts or freight more than a smaller retailer could dream of. They also have the advantage of no sales tax by selling out of state. They typically don't sell many whole-goods either so without local dealers selling the whole-goods the brand will die and you will get no parts whatsoever. I would agree that if they don't pay freight on the order they should not charge you freight but its late in the season and they likely aren't ordering much if anything for stock this time of year.

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FlashandFlare
quote:
Originally posted by Chris727
I guess you mis-interpreted my statement. I just meant that I'm happy to pay a little bit more when necessary to keep local people working, maybe not $18 more, but maybe $10 more. The internet and box stores are killing these businesses. They buy in such large volumes that they can discount the parts or freight more than a smaller retailer could dream of. They also have the advantage of no sales tax by selling out of state. They typically don't sell many whole-goods either so without local dealers selling the whole-goods the brand will die and you will get no parts whatsoever. I would agree that if they don't pay freight on the order they should not charge you freight but its late in the season and they likely aren't ordering much if anything for stock this time of year.
I agree with supporting local dealers, I have seen the internet kill powersport dealers time and time again. I guess I really got a bad taste from this dealer when I asked for a total for my 7 items and his reply was "Gonna be around $60 dollars" I replied with "around ?" like $59.99 or $67.00 ? He replied with "$68.90" IMHO, thats not "around" 60 that might as well be $70 correct ? Followed up by the added $18 for shipping. His quote of around $60 now just turned into $95 after uncle sam gets his share. And until coming on here and starting this thread, I didn't believe it was common practice for a dealer to charge shipping on OE parts.

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FlashandFlare
quote:
Originally posted by jfrank1962
I'm pretty sure I won't be stepping into "Jeff's small engines" in Wautoma anytime soon, if ever again. Your dealer may not be to upset if you don't stop back :O:O:O
Not sure I understand what is meant by your comment, but why wouldn't this dealer want more sales like this ? All he had to do was enter the part numbers I supplied into his order form and then make one phone call when they came in. Pure profit for only a few minutes or less typing on the keyboard, but instead he insisted on being greedy. Maybe thats the problem, he wasn't gonna make any money off the shop labor rate so he had to make it up somewhere right ? He's not my dealer, all my stuff is older. My walk behind Snowblower is from mid 80's and my tractor is from the early 90's Bought all of my stuff second hand. I merely stopped by this dealer as I pass it on my way home from work and believe it or not I wanted to support a dealer in lieu of the latter. I will still buy from a Simplicity dealer, just not this one.

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timflury
I haven't ordered parts from my dealer lately, but when I do, I have noticed that parts I buy from him are a few pennies more than online prices, namely Briggs prices. I asked him about shipping charges, and he did say that he pays the cost for shipping. He might place only one, or two bulk orders a week. But he never directly charges me for shipping.

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Al
Hi, I might mention that we have been around for 35 years. As I look around I see very few dealers that have survived in the the smaller towns around here. I have seen many competitors start up and in a year or 2 be gone and broke. These people make the banks be hesitant to loan money at lower interest rates to OPE dealers. When you are a small operator and if you have a couple of lines, it is hard to meet the demands of the OEMs. If you have a goal of ordering 30,000, 50,000 or 90,000 you need to meet these goals, or there are no benefits, like dating, co-op advertising, freight benefits and the list goes on. We have about 1/2 half a million dollars in inventory and are in a town of 5000 people. How many of you are willing to borrow or invest in this type of items and not sleep nights sometimes. Whether you sell it or not the costs go on, The cost of insuring it can amount to over 15,000 a year. This is about 1200 a month or 45.00 plus dollars a day plus interest in having this stuff on hand to sell. These cost go on even if no one comes through your door. Then you take an item that is really hot and in 2 years it is dead. I probably have 200,000 dollars worth of inventory that is old stock and I should not have. If I sell it on the obsolete market it will bring .05 to .10 cents on the dollar. This is really exciting if you are looking at your retirement account. I take many calls a day to help people that will never buy from me. A business consultant will tell me you can't afford to waste your time talking to these people. I know a 60.00 an hour labor rate is high, but I see that I can not survive without it. When I am on the phone trying to help someone, I could be billing time in the shop at 60.00. I do not charge for this and often when I am done, the person will go to an internet site etc, and I get nothing. Internet sites have very low overhead and can sell with very little direct labor. A friend of mine who is very successful keeps telling me that I am too nice and nobody would give away this free time. I believe that if I want a customer to buy from me I need to be helpful and give in order to receive. Years back, you could work out of your garage and sign up as a non listed engine dealer and get the same discounts I get. I would have to do warranty on anything that was sold for that mfr. You would only have to do the warranty on what you sold. You had no inventory requirements. In the last few years, the engine companies have changed their policies. Now if you want to be an engine dealer you have to put 5 or 7000 in parts on the shelf and buy 3 to 8 engines. You must also pay 500 to 1000 to send someone to a 5 day school, if they leave you must send someone else. Then there are the update schools 1 day and you pay whoever goes and 40 to 75 dollars per person reg fee. By the time you add the wages, the reg fee and the mileage it all adds up. Now you get set up for 2 or 3 engine companies, we do 5 you have a significant overhead that comes out of billable labor. I hire quite a few high school kids and send them to all of the update classes, I pay for them to go, but not their time. They go and take their certificate to school and get school attendance credit and it goes in their file. I typically pay for 30 man days of school a year. These are hours I pay including benefits and vacation etc. which are not recoverable. I feel my people should attend all of these educational opportunities in order for customers to get professional service. Now lets talk about freight, depending on the company, most have a minimum order. Next they have an order amount that they will give free freight maybe from 100. to 350. We don't normally charge freight on orders for companies we are franchised for, like Briggs, Kohler, Simplicity, Gravely etc. We may say we just ordered and it will be a coulple of days until we order. If you need it immediately we will charge freight, but if we can buy a couple of days, no freight chg. If it is a customer that buys a lot of stuff from us we might go further. For something like MTD parts, they will have freight, because we have no franchise contract with them. If you are setting on 150,000 worth of tractors and it is a drought year like this year, you OWN these units and the interest will be 15,000 per year and when they aren't selling, 50. a day that goes on and does not bring any money in. If you go out of business, and send the tractors back, they deduct 20% from what you paid for them. Before you tear into any dealer, it is like the old saying sometimes walking a mile in his shoes may allow you to see a few items you had missed. If your dealer is NETTING 5% to 8% on gross sales he is pretty normal, 10% I need to meet him. Al Eden

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MysTiK
I think that if you want to know the exact cost bottom line to the exact penny that you ask the specific question at the time. That's not always possible either. And in a small shop it takes time which might not be available. And often these deals are done very casually because most people just want a ballpark figure and go do it, see ya later. This makes sense to me; and it's the direct result of me coolly and calmly discussing it rhoroughly with MY dealer. The conversation was necessary after I heard the ACTUAL COST of a parts order. I found it very helpful to have a good discussion and come to mutual understanding rather than go off on a public rant changing the story to suit my mood in a nice friendly forum. That thread still exists somewhere here. My main concern was my desire to continue receiving valued help from this dealership, and specifically the owner himself. That was big for me. And worth more than character assassination at your every whim. And funny also - folks here told me straight up to live and learn, that I should have checked costs ahead of time. Sure that was an issue; but the real problem was my own concern that I was losing an ally who has helped me considerably in previous interactions, where I needed emergency repairs - and I was made high priority, and mowing again 2 hours later. I very much value that. And I have retained it. Good business is a two-way street. It doesn't always work out that way; but if there is a genuine interest in building it, it is often possible. If it proves itself otherwise, there is nothing to lose - except perhaps convenience. I have a nasty temper when it flies and I have learned when the war is worth waging - sometimes. This isn't it. Enjoy your rant. Perhaps next time you could simply present the facts of the story; and ask for feedback. It sounds more like you want to fight with everybody. I'm not interested in that. I doubt I am alone there. But, hey, it's ok to be angry; no problem. Enjoy it.

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briggsetc
Well said AL !! I was thinking something similar when I saw the previous comment .... "Along with shipping they should start charging for the use of the lights when I am looking at there inventory, or the kilowatts used to power the cash register" . You are already paying those charges in ANY business. I am pretty sure Wallmart gets a light bill every month. Gary

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DanD
Here is how I've always had things done in the past. I've ordered a lot more stuff for farm equipment over the years, but found the lawn and garden stuff generally to be the same way. 1. If you need something ASAP and is not something in stock, you have to pay the shipping. 2. If something is in stock, then of course there is no shipping charge. 3. If something needed to be ordered and you weren't in a hurry, I'd ask the parts man if he could put it on his weekly stock order. Then, there was no shipping either but could take a week or so. Is it different than this now?

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timflury
As a customer, if I order something at my local dealer, and he charges me for shipping, I would like to have it shipped to my doorstep so I could save the trouble of another visit. And really?? If I'm running a business with my machines, then I will need parts ASAP. But as a hobbyist, it really isn't important.

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RayS
No, I don`t things are different now. If I order a part I ask how much it cost and how much I will owe when I pick it up ( I don`t like surprises unless I benefit from it). If I ask them to get the part I morally feel obligated to buy. I don`t sit around and wonder if I am getting screwed on the price (because I know what it is going to cost me when it comes in). This part of the deal is the buyers responsibility when they ask someone to order parts for them. If you don`t want the parts after finding out the price simply walk away. He should have told you that there was a $ 18 shipping charge. My local dealer is the same price as Jack`s online and sometimes cheaper. They are great people to deal with and it is probably the reason they have been in business as long as they have. I edited your post with the profanity because of more than one complaint from the membership. This is a PG13 site and that is agreed upon on registration. Disgust can be defined without profanity. Keep it simple and keep it clean. There are minors here as well.

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