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No Spark 7016H

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docs

I have a 7016h w/briggs model 326437 type 0252-01. code is 7806011 I have no spark at the points. I need to no if there were certain issues with these or some good trouble shooting tips. I installed new condenser and still no spark. points look good. cleaned mag and set gap to .010 and points at .020. Could it be ignition switch?

Thought it might be worth mentioning it was running idle when it died, it did same thing couple months ago and I installed new condenser after a minute or so I got the spark back. I had bad spot in kill wire that I taped up but had cont. from end of wire to ign. switch.

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EdFromMason

Hi Doc, must be the month for 7016 issues. take a look at my posting titled New issues with the 7016. Think your issue might be the ignition switch as I believe that was part of my problem.

Good luck.

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GLPointon

9 times out of 10 I find a no spark issue to be a bad condenser...

Try it with the points cover off. The wire can get grounded from being pinched at the notch in the cover. Or try it with the ignition "kill" wire disconnected from the terminal tab @ the points cover. Then if it has spark you'll know the trbl is at/between the points connector and the key switch...Good luck sm01

ps...you'll need the wire back on to kill the engine if it starts or ground the spark plug

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EdFromMason

Hi Doc, WUHU got my 7016 running had a wire in the wrong place on the new ignition switch. Had to pour a little gas in the carb and a few cranks she was run-in. If the points and condenser are good check your ignition switch.

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docs

I installed a new condenser earlier today & when that didn't fix it I tried looking for tips. I pulled the ground from ignition and that didn't help. I have the points cover off and have checked wires, There all good, I pulled engine & cover to clean and set the gap to .020.I will try pulling the kill switch to see if that does anything.Thanks

quote:Originally posted by GLPointon

9 times out of 10 I find a no spark issue to be a bad condenser...Try it with the points cover off. The wire can get grounded from being pinched at the notch in the cover. Or try it with the ignition "kill" wire disconnected from the terminal tab @ the points cover. Then if it has spark you'll know the trbl is at/between the points connector and the key switch...Good luck sm01ps...you'll need the wire back on to kill the engine if it starts or ground the spark plug


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docs

Is that strange or what. there's like 3 in the last coupl days w/spark issues. lolsm00

quote:Originally posted by OkieGT

All 7016s are on strike this month, no spark till they see some love, lol


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spyder400k

id try useing a ohm meater to see if your points are good. they may be grounded at the source? secound place to look is at the backing plate its a stud with a couple of fiber washers to prevent grounding at this point. place to start folowing the trail back to the coil.

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docs

OK Will test in morning, Thanks

quote:Originally posted by spyder400k

id try useing a ohm meater to see if your points are good. they may be grounded at the source? secound place to look is at the backing plate its a stud with a couple of fiber washers to prevent grounding at this point. place to start folowing the trail back to the coil.


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GLPointon

Make sure the points are opening and closing...If you've done all the kill wire tests and still no spark then maybe your flywheel sheered its key or the Coil is bad (rare)

What happened just before you lost spark?

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docs

Nothing I had just started it up and moved it to the garage when it just died. Had same problem couple months ago and replaced the condenser and it took a minute but it got it's spark back. Points are opening right I cleaned them with lite sandpaper to see if that would help. I checked the switches for the Hydro Lever and The PTO Lever with ohm meter and all that seems to be working. Course it will not even crank if those are engaged. I replaced the Key Last Year it Was Parcely Sheard but it would still get spark just out of time. I Stuck Volt/Ohm Meter on the ground and spark plug end of coil wire and turned the flywheel by hand and could get variable voltages so it seems like that is working ok. Gonna try see if points are grounded today had busy day yesterday and didn't get a chance to check that. Is there any way of testing a condenser?

quote:Originally posted by GLPointon

Make sure the points are opening and closing...If you've done all the kill wire tests and still no spark then maybe your flywheel sheered its key or the Coil is bad (rare) What happened just before you lost spark?


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docs

Yea I Hear Ya, This has been a great tractor best ever made in my opinion, There tuff as nails. Its 35 or so years old and never failed me but this one has me stumped. I'm sure it's something simple just a matter of finding what it is.

Originally posted by mikeman
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powerking_one

Since you've had the flywheel off before due to replacing a partially sheared key, it's entirely possible that has happened again. It is Critical to get the flywheel nut torqued to a minimum of 145 Ft-Lbs to prevent it from shearing. Most people don't have a "feel" for arm-strong torquing fasteners much beyond 50 Ft-Lbs or so (as I don't) and using a torque wrench removes the guesswork.

Tom (PK)

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docs

I torqed it heavy because of that. I had the cover off and the flywhell is fine, if it a had a sheared key it would still fire but just be out of time right? I just tested the points to ground and it is grounding to the case. Took the points off and there is no neopreme washers or anything behind these points. Anybody got a image of these points mounted or some kinda of intstructions for this. Points are in great shape no burning or anything.

quote:Originally posted by powerking_one

Since you've had the flywheel off before due to replacing a partially sheared key, it's entirely possible that has happened again. It is Critical to get the flywheel nut torqued to a minimum of 145 Ft-Lbs to prevent it from shearing. Most people don't have a "feel" for arm-strong torquing fasteners much beyond 50 Ft-Lbs or so (as I don't) and using a torque wrench removes the guesswork. Tom (PK)


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powerking_one

With points/magneto engines like the B&S we're talking about, if the key partially shears then it may still have spark at the plug, but the timing is off enough that you end up with a no start/run condition. If the key is sheared more severely, then the phase relationship between the magnets passing over the coil and the points opening/closing is too far off resulting in a no spark condition. I know it is a P.I.T.A. to have to pull then engine to inspect the key/key-way but sometimes there's no other choice to troubleshoot the problem.

Tom(PK)

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docs

So if the Points are Grounding out would that cause a no spark issue?If thats not it I will pull the engine again it's not that bad only takes about 30min. to get it out.

quote:Originally posted by powerking_one

With points/magneto engines like the B&S we're talking about, if the key partially shears then it may still have spark at the plug, but the timing is off enough that you end up with a no start/run condition. If the key is sheared more severely, then the phase relationship between the magnets passing over the coil and the points opening/closing is too far off resulting in a no spark condition. I know it is a P.I.T.A. to have to pull then engine to inspect the key/key-way but sometimes there's no other choice to troubleshoot the problem. Tom(PK)


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docs

Well the Flywheel key is fine, I see how the points work, They have a neopreme washer in behind the back point and when the point opens there is no ground alowing it to spark at that point of opening. That timing all has to be perfect.

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docs

Maybe I got a bad new condenser! Is there anyway of testing a condenser?

quote:Originally posted by docs

Well the Flywheel key is fine, I see how the points work, They have a neopreme washer in behind the back point and when the point opens there is no ground alowing it to spark at that point of opening. That timing all has to be perfect.


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MrSteele

Check the cable on the points that is supposed to be soldered to the body of the points. Had the same issue as you describe on my 325431 series, ran great then would not start for love or money. Replaced condenser, cleaned points, cleaned them again, bought a new condenser, replaced it again, taped wires, made a new grommet for the wires, put heat shrink on the wires, taped them for extra insulation, got mad and quit several times...

Decided to replace the points, though I knew that was not the problem. Cable was broken loose from back of points. Never seen it happen before, put a new set in, and the old girl started right up. Will find a way to solder that back onto the steel body

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docs

I'll Check that out. It's gotta be something stupid like that. Might be worth the money to invest in points even thoe they look fine. I'll ohm test the points from cable to back of points. I also have my eye on a 16hp IC briggs that I might buy soon as the guy gets back with me. My motor has been on it's last leg for nyears now. Like I said earlier post it uses 1/4 quart oil every time I Mow.

quote:Originally posted by MrSteele

Check the cable on the points that is supposed to be soldered to the body of the points. Had the same issue as you describe on my 325431 series, ran great then would not start for love or money. Replaced condenser, cleaned points, cleaned them again, bought a new condenser, replaced it again, taped wires, made a new grommet for the wires, put heat shrink on the wires, taped them for extra insulation, got mad and quit several times...Decided to replace the points, though I knew that was not the problem. Cable was broken loose from back of points. Never seen it happen before, put a new set in, and the old girl started right up. Will find a way to solder that back onto the steel body


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docs

Fianally Success, Bad New Condensor After fixing the bad kill wire to start with I had already installed the new condensor. All I had to do is put the old condenser in and Shazam It's Magic!!!!!

What a new bad part will do to your mind after all that trouble shooting over a few days trying to figure it out. I think they may have put that condenser back in stock before because he acted kinda funny when I baught it and I said that should fix it as it did before and he said we'll see like he may have suspected something wrong with it already. I'm taking it back tomorrow.

TGIF

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