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SmilinSam

Allis 300 to 400 series transition information

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SmilinSam

Sorting through Kents literature today I found some interesting photocopies of literature. Its 6 pages called a "tractors and attachments usage guide".

 It seems to deal with adaptors made available by AC to make life easier on 300 and 400 series users who want to use attachments on a tractor that has different hitch spacings than the attachments they have. Spacing differences caused by the break up of Simplicity and AC between 1971? and 1973?.

Never knew these existed.

 

Shows kits made by AC to change the front and rear hitch spacings on the tractors, as well as rear lift socket kits and implement lift rod kits to change to the other size of diameter. lift rod..

Pretty interesting....

medium.DSCN1987.JPG.7e29a7ca3ce3b9de1b32

medium.DSCN1985.JPG.6c2f692910b0d812b0bd

medium.DSCN1986.JPG.fc0ec7b90ec4787efebe

medium.DSCN1988.JPG.6e2e7ae94e39232b3430

medium.DSCN1989.JPG.591a17d55da6ae257e23

medium.DSCN1990.JPG.35af4bc239757681b41c

 

Edited by SmilinSam
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BLT
16 hours ago, SmilinSam said:

Sorting through Kents literature today I found some interesting photocopies of literature. Its 6 pages called a "tractors and attachments usage guide".

 It seems to deal with adaptors made available by AC to make life easier on 300 and 400 series users who want to use attachments on a tractor that has different hitch spacings than the attachments they have. Spacing differences caused by the break up of Simplicity and AC between 1971? and 1973?.

Never knew these existed.

 

Shows kits made by AC to change the front and rear hitch spacings on the tractors, as well as rear lift socket kits and implement lift rod kits to change to the other size of diameter. lift rod..

Pretty interesting....

Sam if you can mail those to me, I'll try to make PDF copies and post them in the "Downloads" section.

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PhanDad

For my early AC built Homelite T-12 with Vickers, it was very easy to change rear hitch spacing by changing spacers; front is pretty much impossible.  

Looking at the Homelite vs Simplicity parts schematics for my post below, I obviously did more than change spacers to change the hitch spacing.

CRS strikes again. sm02

 

Edited by PhanDad
Corrected amount of work needed to change rear hitch spacing
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SmilinSam
3 hours ago, BLT said:

Sam if you can mail those to me, I'll try to make PDF copies and post them in the "Downloads" section.

I'll make a copy and send when I get to it.

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kwt
11 hours ago, PhanDad said:

For my early AC built Homelite T-12 with Vickers, it was very easy to change rear hitch spacing by changing spacers; front is pretty much impossible.  

 

I've got an Allis built T16H that I run a tiller on. My Simp T16H and my two 3112's have the rear lift, but I've never used them. I always assumed they were identical. Are you telling me they aren't?

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PhanDad
19 hours ago, kwt said:

I always assumed they were identical. Are you telling me they aren't?

The Allis built Homelites had different rear spacing compared to Simplicity; the lift tube was also rectangular rather than round.  Many were converted years ago so standard Simplicity rear attachments could be used.  If your Allis built T16H rear hitch components don't match the Parts Schematic below, someone converted it.  Also, reviewing the Parts Schematics, I did more than change spacers; the"drawbar assembly" is different for sure and maybe the upright bar assemblies as well.  

Allis built Homelite drawbar assembly:

5bc12667432cd_T-12PartsPg24.thumb.JPG.c6a31b6bd590728f18cc7bc4d6704353.JPG

 

Simplicity drawbar assembly:

5bc12723a3a4b_Sov17GTHLPartsPg40.thumb.JPG.8ca93a6dd74fce05e3486c7ecfff282e.JPG

 

Allis Built Homelite Tiller (Note rectangular upper mounting rod and wider spacing on lower mounting bracket:

5bc1266b6c622_Tiller(Square)OpandPartsPg8.thumb.JPG.1a366dceae6144c70e0dd6242bb057dc.JPG

 

Homelite Rear Lift Kit:

Homelite_Rear_Lift_Kit_Pic2.jpg.54c6b9d7a3deffa7b831c02af0977a5f.jpg

 

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SmilinSam

The 74" Allis built Homelites (which came out later  in 1973 and were disconinued in mid to late 74) were redesigned from the 71 , 72, and 73 models. The rear lift socket was changed to the familiar round one  to fit the Simplicity Implements and the rear hitch was redone to match the spacing on the Simplicity tractors.

The front axle and mower deck drive was also totally redesigned to match the Simplicity hitch spacings.. The front end was nothing like the earlier models. The mule drive for the mower deck on these was pretty much the same as what was being used on the new Allis 400 series. The frame and front  axle assembly was also lightened up. Thinner metal was used  in alot of the locations.. I have owned both variations side by side. Quite an interesting experience to take stock  of all these changes first hand.

KWT could have a 74'. Would be interested in seeing a picture showing the front and side of the tractor...

Edited by SmilinSam
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kwt

Not a good pic, but maybe it will help. Obviously the one on the left. Bought new by my grandfather and unmolested it's whole life. The blue tiller has it's own clutch and plugs into the round lift rod and is connected by a vertical pin like my 3112V. The diagrams show a horizontal pin.

0522180847.jpg

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SmilinSam

The Allis built one on the left is a 71-73. The tiller you describe as blue Homelite tiller  with round lift rod and hand clutch is  in my opinion a 1974. The 73's would have had  a rectangualer lift rod, and the 1975(like you Simplicity one on the right) would have been white and without the hand clutch.

I would have to agree with Bill, in that the tractors rear hitch spacing and rear lift socket is not original to the tractor. Probably added/altered  to accomodate the 74 tiller.

However, if the Allis paperwork  mentioned above is any indication, Homelite may have had the same options available.  Could be a 73 model tractor that  was bought late enough in the year to have a 74 model tiller sold with it by the dealer, along with a transition kit to mount the newer style tiller to the older style tractor. 

I have come across loads of 71-73 paperwork, but nothing as yet on the 74's. In fact I have had a half dozen 71-73 tractors, but only one 74....and its the only one I have ever seen in person.  If I had known it was a one year wonder, I would have probably kept it...

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PhanDad

The "late model Allis built Homelites" I posted above are '74's, according to @SmilinSam, IMO, he's the "Homie" expert on the site.  The changes to the pictured tractors are as he described (front axle, mule drive, etc).  

I have a T-12, it's an early "early version" and a brother of the T-15; I assume it is a '71:

Deck_Old_Last_Cut2a.jpg.eb6cdaea786defa59a70a12f805a9610.jpg

 

  Although there aren't many part difference between my tractor and the later "early version" Homelites, one difference is the drag link.  The steering wheel end of my T12's drag link was just a hole with a spacer as can be seen in the T-12/15 parts schematic:

  5bc2902533c77_T-12PartsPg12.thumb.JPG.483eb8fb4dbb7dd2305d74693b96cdfc.JPG

It "egged out" and made the steering sloppy; I changed the "hole" to a rod end to tighten up the steering.

I then learned the later "early versions" used a ball joint at the steering wheel end as can be seen in the T16H parts schematic:

5bc29028d72d1_T-16PartsPg16.thumb.JPG.a6f8d8cedffc22fe63c5bee9c2c1d7da.JPG

So if you check the steering wheel end of the drag link, you'll have an indication of model year.

 

Edited by PhanDad
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PhanDad
25 minutes ago, kwt said:

I cant find the numbers on my Allis Homey to save my life.

Might be down on the side of the tin under the carb if it's similar to my T-12's :

IMG_7356.thumb.JPG.ae0267359eeb7ac756bc0e152ce042a8.JPG

 

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kwt
14 hours ago, PhanDad said:

Might be down on the side of the tin under the carb if it's similar to my T-12's :

IMG_7356.thumb.JPG.ae0267359eeb7ac756bc0e152ce042a8.JPG

 

Build date 9-13-72. It has ball joint steering on both ends of the arm.

Edited by kwt

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