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Jeffrey Gee

Simplicity 17-GTH-L

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Jeffrey Gee

I need some help trying to find the engine #s for my simplicity. I bought this mower and the engine tag was wiped clean of any specific engine info. The tractor info is model 1691957 with a serial # 4349. It's a Kohler KT17 series II. It is all original and in excellent shape. Is there any way to come up with the engine numbers beyond the KT17 series II ?? Any help would be greatly appreciated! Thanks in advance.

20190312_232321.jpg

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Brettw

I would suggest going to the Kohler site.  Look at their manuals.  It is free, and they have both owners and service manuals.  You may be able to get more detail on a model number there, and you will certainly get every bit of information you need on the KT and Magnum engines.  Good Luck!

Edited by Brettw
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SmilinSam
9 hours ago, wwbragg said:

Removing the engine tag should be a federal offense, like removing the tag on a mattress..

Not a fan of Kohlers shiny metallic stickers used for engine info.  If they dont fall off from not sticky enough glue, the oil dissloves the  ink they use for the print...

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wwbragg
53 minutes ago, SmilinSam said:

Not a fan of Kohlers

From what I have heard about Kohlers, engine tags are the least of their issues.  They should go to jail anyway..

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SmilinSam
3 hours ago, wwbragg said:

From what I have heard about Kohlers, engine tags are the least of their issues.  They should go to jail anyway..

You didnt quite quote me all the way.  I dont care for the data stickers, but I would take a Kohler cast iron single cylinder, or a Command twin over a Briggs cast iron single or a Vanguard twin any time. I have put thousands of trouble free hours on the Kohlers, but cant say the same about the Briggs I have had.

Edited by SmilinSam
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wwbragg

OOPS!  My bad.  Yeah, Briggs has their problems too.  Take for example the piston valve assembly shown below.  My 7119 came with two engines in a box of parts and this was amongst the rest.

DSCF0053.JPG

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PhanDad
2 hours ago, MARK (LI) said:

What were the known problems?....

With the Triads I assume you mean.

Main issue was fuel pump on valve cover flexed the cover causing it to leak.  Leak ran down onto cooling fins.  Oil trapped grass chaff and cylinder overheated and dropped sleeve grenading the engine.  Also an issue with pushing a lot of chaff into the air filter housings.  

It's my understanding that when this issues were fixed, it's a great engine.  But Kohler gave up on it after replacing many engines.  Now it's hard to get parts for them.  

  

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Chris727
7 hours ago, SmilinSam said:

You didnt quite quote me all the way.  I dont care for the data stickers, but I would take a Kohler cast iron single cylinder, or a Command twin over a Briggs cast iron single or a Vanguard twin any time. I have put thousands of trouble free hours on the Kohlers, but cant say the same about the Briggs I have had.

Just the opposite here. Have had much better luck with the Briggs cast singles than the Kohlers. I have a fresh rebuilt K341 (cost a boat load) here that is giving me fits with a compression release and probably needs to come back apart. Never had that problem with Briggs. Other than knocking or sometimes using oil, for the most part the B&S just keep going and going. 

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Brettw

I think both the Briggs and Kohler engines are excellent for the most part.  The Triads were a problem, but more due to not having quite the right engineering.  They would have been an excellent motor had they figured out the issues prior to the public figuring them out via failure.  They could have been great, but their reputation preceded their death.

Either of the brands are good if properly maintained.  Poor maintenance is usually the death of these before their time.  If people keep them clean, and the oil changed and use them as intended, they last an amazingly long time. IMHO

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PhanDad
2 hours ago, Brettw said:

Either of the brands are good if properly maintained.  Poor maintenance is usually the death of these before their time.  If people keep them clean, and the oil changed and use them as intended, they last an amazingly long time. IMHO

Well said.

Although I do like one brand's toilet inferences.  666

 

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PhanDad

@MARK (LI),

Al's Triad Comments:

Hi, I know the triad has a bad reputation, I am sad that it died prematurely. We started in the repower business with the TH engine in the 7100 family. This engine is everything everyone should want. No head gaskets, low emissions, overhead cams, etc. I am an old race guy and this engine had it all. The problem TOO MUCH TECHNOLOGY TOO SOOn. I would have loved to see Kohler "fix" this engine. The problems new technology, the lost foam casting technology. Barely state of the art at the time. Not enough people in the US had the technical ability to do it. When the automotive supplier dropped Kohler due to to small of orders, they went to a Co overseas. Deliver schedules, cost and quality were problems. This engine was the ENGINE OF TOMORROW TODAY. The problems were sleeves dropping and the leaking valve covers that caused dirt collection and overheating. The design of the air cleaner that trapped grass residue. We came up with a fix that fixed the plugged air cleaner cartridge problem. Unfortunately the image was destroyed before all of the Pluses were considered. Early on in the end of the TH scenario we provided Kohler CH engines and kits to change the TH to CH in Sovereigns under warranty. Later in the program, we provided Simplicity with the kits when Kohler provided the engines under warranty. Uniquely were a Kohler dealer and vendor and a Simplicity dealer and vendor. When a new product using cutting edge technology is developed it is a gamble to a manufacturer. Basically this is a technologically wonderful engine design. The process of putting the sleeves in the cylinder and having them be reliable was an issue. I think fixing the oil leak problem and opening up the air cleaner would have made it the engine of the future. Ultimately Kohler abandoned the project. We have some of these engines out running reliably with over 1500 hours on them. They are not all bad. I personally am proud of Kohler for using the latest concepts in the design of this engine. With some work, I could conceive these engines turning 9500 rpm in pullers if the sleeve problems were solved. Kind reminds me of the Corvair, which several of my friends had and loved. They suffered an unfair demise. I know these engines had short comings, but give Kohler credit for having the vision for the engine of the future. These type issues involve taking PRUDENT risk. The engines has had its problems, but it was not all bad. The concept was good and Kohler went beyond advertised warranty period the make the failures right. I personally was involved in providing kits to repower tractors that were in the 4 to 5 year failure period. Cut Kohler some slack for going the extra mile to support their product. I still believe with the technology that exists today regarding "Lost Foam Casting" the TH would really be the engine of tomorrow today. Sorry it didn't live long enough to be reborn. My 2 cents worth and its free, value accordingly. Al Eden
 
 

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