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Simplicity 17 GTHL


Snojetter

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I picked this rig up this morning. 5 hour round trip with my wife who wanted to come along.  Fun trip! Seller was a widowed gal who had upgraded to a larger mower.  Very sweet lady who was a joy to deal with. Her husband was meticulous about maintenance and it shows. 

Tractor comes with a 48" deck. Unfortunately, it was stored up against a wall in a bed of hay, so the non-discharge end has bad corrosion. Otherwise, the deck is in fantastic shape.

The KT 17 doesn't run great. I bought it with the intention of swapping in a low hour Magnum 18 from my 7117 and then sending that one down the road. It might just be a simple carb adjustment or plug change.  I'll put some time into it this weekend and try to figure it out.  It doesn't smoke though!

When I got home, it wasn't two minutes before my girls were crawling all over it.

 

20200731_170012.jpg

20200731_170218.jpg

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2 hours ago, Snojetter said:

it wasn't two minutes before my girls were crawling all over it.

Can't beat kids and tractors.  sm01

 

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Both girls claimed it for their own.  That led to a squabble not captured by the camera. 0:)  Guess they forgot about the other two behind the shop door...

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On 7/31/2020 at 5:44 PM, Snojetter said:

The KT 17 doesn't run great. I bought it with the intention of swapping in a low hour Magnum 18 from my 7117

Took the carb apart and found the rubber tip on the needle was coming off.  Took a week to get a new carb kit in the mail, but I installed that last night. It was late, so didn't get a chance to test it out. I'd like to mow the yard with it today, so we'll see how that goes. 

One question: my understanding is the Magnum is a Series 2 KT17 with electronic ignition.  Is this the only difference or are there other changes, big or small?

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 8/8/2020 at 10:22 AM, Snojetter said:

One question: my understanding is the Magnum is a Series 2 KT17 with electronic ignition.  Is this the only difference or are there other changes, big or small?

That is my understanding.  @MikeES @Brettw will be able to definitively answer.

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For the most part, this was the difference.  The 17 went to an 18 HP rating and the 19 to a 20.  I think some of the Series II had oil filters and almost all of the Magnums did.  To my knowledge there are few other differences, other than the ignition system.

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Thanks guys.  My two Magnums have oil filters, the KT does not.  I've mowed the yard once so far since the fix and she does a great job.  The motor doesn't smoke at all and runs smooth both at idle and full speed.  It does want to hesitate off idle when I push the throttle to ful power...must be starving for fuel at that transition point.  Other than that, it operates as expected.  In fact, it starts at the touch of the key - my Magnums take a couple revolutions before they fire.  I probably won't mow too much more this year, seems I'm going a couple weeks between cuttings now.  But I'll put the hours on this tractor to see how things go.

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5 hours ago, Snojetter said:

My two Magnums have oil filters, the KT does not

I'm fairly certain that all the 17 GTH-L tractors had the late model Series II KT engines.  That being said, do you have a rectangular looking plate held on with two Allen head cap screws on the Right hand side of the engine in front of the cylinder?  If so, that can be removed & a filter adapter can be added.  As stated in other posts, you will have to cut or grind about 7/16" off the vertical aspect of the frame for filter clearance.  This will not harm the tractor in any way.

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5 hours ago, ShaunE said:

I'm fairly certain that all the 17 GTH-L tractors had the late model Series II KT engines.

Shaun,

This is the only right side pic I have of the shot KT-17 that was in the 17-GTH-L I bought:

SovShotEngine.jpg.5a5103181c05996607c3898a74e13ff5.jpg

I'm curious, would the plate you describe be under the tin?  Or the pic isn't at the correct angle to see the plate?  

 

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the pic isn't at the right angle. I was going to post one I had but,  I looked at every picture I've taken of the right side of my 17-GTH-L and since I wasn't deliberately trying to take a picture of the block-off plate,  it is always behind something. From behind, hidden by cylinder, from above hidden by heat shield, from in front hidden by hood.

Anyway it is just in front of the right cylinder, under the exhaust pipe and heat shield

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8 hours ago, PhanDad said:

Or the pic isn't at the correct angle to see the plate

Bill I found this picture on the net as I don't have any of my own for some dumb reason.  This is a picture of the plate that can be removed & the filter adapter can be added.

*Note* - This picture is not in a Simplicity or Allis tractor.

 

post-1573-132893947333.jpg

Edited by ShaunE
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18 hours ago, ShaunE said:

I'm fairly certain that all the 17 GTH-L tractors had the late model Series II KT engines.  That being said, do you have a rectangular looking plate held on with two Allen head cap screws on the Right hand side of the engine in front of the cylinder?  If so, that can be removed & a filter adapter can be added.  As stated in other posts, you will have to cut or grind about 7/16" off the vertical aspect of the frame for filter clearance.  This will not harm the tractor in any way.

I'm pretty sure I noticed that plate when I was looking the tractor over.  But now that it's been several days, I'm not positive.  Will take a look next time I get to the shop - it'll be time to mow again in the next day or two.  My plan was to put one of my Magnum's in this tractor, so shaving the frame was in the cards.

Are those filter adapters easy to find?

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On ‎8‎/‎20‎/‎2020 at 9:42 AM, Snojetter said:

Are those filter adapters easy to find

They aren't terrible to find & do show up on eBay quite often.

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 8/18/2020 at 8:01 PM, Brettw said:

For the most part, this was the difference.  The 17 went to an 18 HP rating and the 19 to a 20.  I think some of the Series II had oil filters and almost all of the Magnums did.  To my knowledge there are few other differences, other than the ignition system.

The Magnums use a smooth flywheel with a bolted on plastic blade fan that is much more efficient than the cast fan blades on the KT engines.  It was easy to notice the higher air flow across the heads on my M20 than on my KT19.  Also the Magnums I have had and seen did not have baffles in the fan shroud (probably because of the more efficient fan).

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Does this translate to better cooling overall on the Magnums or do the additional baffles make up for the less efficient fan blades (in your opinion)?  It seems to me, all things Kohler K-series run really hot and I tend to keep my tractors parked on the hottest of days, or at least not work them hard.  I just don't get the warm fuzzies when it's 90+ and I'm out mowing...though I've done it and everything - including myself - has survived.

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One other interesting note on the 17GTH L.  I believe this was the first of the transition to a standard Sovereign Series tractor.  In that, I mean, this is how they came. Hydro drive, hydro lift, 23x10.50x12 tires, one engine size and type.  No more gear, shuttle, hydro, drive options.  No more manual, electric hydro lift options.  No 10,12,14,16,17,18,19, diesel, Kohler, Briggs, Lombardi, options.  No more different sized tires. And this is the way they were built moving forward, until the end of production. I believe the only options available were power steering (and hour meter, rear lift, add-on's) .  The engine packages changed Triton, Commands, etc.  But that is how they were then produced for that run.   

I could be wrong on this, so others can certainly chime in, but I believe the GTH-L led the way on this and was likely a start to a more efficient and profitable company. 

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4 hours ago, Brettw said:

But that is how they were then produced for that run.   

I believe Al said the 17GTH-L was the Sovereign model brought back when the dealers complained about the first production stop of the Sovereign.  

Customers still wanted to buy the Sovereign to continue to use the numerous attachments they owned. It would definitely make business sense to make a single “up scale” model for those that wanted to replace their old tractor while other “new” customers bought the newer generation ones.  
 

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