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hurleyii

Garage cleaning pt2 7116 restore ?

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hurleyii

Ok guys I'm doing frame prep as we speak. It's getting a 20hp command.

I've taken all the measurements from my sovereign from hood to to every section of the front frame.

So here's the plan. Sovereign hood is the exact same except the bottom of the hood itself ( center counsel to what would be under the lights front tip is a ⅛- ¼ longer which from what I can see will have no actual aff ct of fitment. 

So my intentions are to lower the front profile of the hood by cutting the frame and welding to match a Sovereign frame . So when I'm don't it will have the slopped hood of a Sovereign but the paint job of a 7100 series. Is there anything else that's different that I could possibly be missing like the cowel or center colum slightly different.

Also for the engine mounting I'm using the Sunstar 16hp Magnum bracket which will put the engine on motor mounts. The engine itself will be bolted to the steel plate and the plate will be installed upside down so the plate will technically be what has the motor mounts. 

 

 

IMG_20210316_195014.jpg

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hurleyii
1 hour ago, rockfangd said:

want more details:D

Pics!  Hopefully they load in order. 

Step 1. Complete 

Disclaimer for my lawyer! 

No matter how pretty your cut is after you grind it down to a smooth flat finish don't touch it!  Don't ask me how I know this! :o

 

 

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PhanDad

I may be too late, but in the Downloads sections, there's Al's directions on how to install a Command in a 7100 Series tractor. There are dimensions for an adapter plate:

image.thumb.png.ddd24067718a5cdec976bfa99787ecbe.png

It might be worth checking out:

https://simpletractors.com/files/file/56-repower-instructions-of-900-7100-tractor/

 

Edited by PhanDad
Added adapter plate info

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hurleyii
30 minutes ago, PhanDad said:

I may be too late, but in the Downloads sections, there's Al's directions on how to install a Command in a 7100 Series tractor. There are dimensions for an adapter plate:

image.thumb.png.ddd24067718a5cdec976bfa99787ecbe.png

It might be worth checking out:

https://simpletractors.com/files/file/56-repower-instructions-of-900-7100-tractor/

 

Downloaded it a few days ago. I've planned a motor mount tractor in a 7100 for years just didn't know how to accomplish it. I mentioned it years back but I was told it wasn't possible. Gutting the Sunstar gave me what I needed. I never did understand how it was impossible when we have to raise the command ⅞-¹⁵/¹⁶ .

If anyone has the exact height that would be great as Sunstar 16hp motor mounts are ⅞ with the washer .

However I'm sure I'll be needing some of that info. Also thought I bought the white paint already but all I can find is primer. So if anyone has found a good implement white that's a good match that would be great. 

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Bill725
8 hours ago, hurleyii said:

So if anyone has found a good implement white that's a good match that would be great. 

Rustoleum Canvas White in spray can.

Attached is the drawing of the Command.

Kohler Command Dwg.jpg

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PhanDad
12 hours ago, hurleyii said:

I never did understand how it was impossible when we have to raise the command ⅞-¹⁵/¹⁶ .

If anyone has the exact height that would be great as Sunstar 16hp motor mounts are ⅞ with the washer .

OK, I'm confused.  Been that a lot lately.  Maybe you're talking Command in a SunStar, not a Sovereign.

As to a Sovereign, I have the following understanding.

As I read Al's Command Install into a 7100 series tractor, it appears the plate is just for making sure you drill the existing frame at the correct locations.  And I don't understand the need for the hole saw drilling.  

But I believe the crank vertical centerline dimension is 6-1/8" for the 16 HP single cylinder Briggs, the Kohler K series, KT series, and CH series.  The TH (OHC Triad) was the odd duck at 5-1/4".  The adapter plate installed in a Triad powered Sovereign is 7/8" high.  

The Command drawing is provided by @Bill725 above.  

The Briggs drawing:

image.thumb.png.c8124de87066c13be1bb3804fc66fbb6.png

I haven't been able to find a K or KT series drawing, but numerous written references state the height is 6-1/8".  

The "odd duck" Triad drawing:

image.png.2f37ee4d9f83d435b06827efbcc63388.png

 

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rbstuartjr

I’ve been following along and confused as well. Both my commands and k series mount right to the frame in the engine bay, no plate. Phandad, you are correct about pto crank shaft height. I’ll keep following to understand all this, as I am wanting to put a Command in my 910.

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hurleyii

Ok you guys are correct.i was thinking the Command was just like my Brig's requiring a spacer plate.ive been looking for one for a bit. I suppose I got confused in the fact it's been sometime since I did my last repower with newer engine and this was supposed to be getting a Vanguard originally. Thank you guys very much you saved me a lot of time. Would of worked out as I was going to mount the Sunstar plate to my tractor via motor mounts but still would of been time invested and an extra set of holes in frame. 

Thank you guys very much! 

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MikeES
4 hours ago, PhanDad said:

But I believe the crank vertical centerline dimension is 6-1/8" for the 16 HP single cylinder Briggs, the Kohler K series, KT series, and CH series.  The TH (OHC Triad) was the odd duck at 5-1/4".  The adapter plate installed in a Triad powered Sovereign is 7/8" high.  

Add the Magnums are 6-1/8" list also.

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hurleyii

Update pics! Step 2 completed. Now to fill muffler hole in,and finish smoothing the welds down. If you guys look you will see I beveled the metal on both sides so I could grind it down flat. 

 

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hurleyii
2 hours ago, Chris727 said:

Looking good! 

Thanks Chris. It's the most welding I've ever done in my life. So it's definitely a learning experience. Had a couple pin holes I had to patch and all is done except grinding the pin holes back down but my back has had enough. So tomorrow is another day. Tomorrow I will finish grinding it smooth and drill hood holes and motor mount holes. After that I'll pop the frame off the BGB and strip everything for painting. Here's her current condition.

  I know you guys are like wth this guy started on a loader project and now he's on his 3rd tractor and didn't finish loader. Well I was tired of working in the driveway . Lol so this was the best way to get my garage back. FYI the 912h repower with the Magnum was a full success. I'll post the pics tomorrow. She is hiding under the hood for this tractor currently though. Lol 

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hurleyii
On 3/16/2021 at 10:35 PM, PhanDad said:

I may be too late, but in the Downloads sections, there's Al's directions on how to install a Command in a 7100 Series tractor. There are dimensions for an adapter plate:

image.thumb.png.ddd24067718a5cdec976bfa99787ecbe.png

It might be worth checking out:

https://simpletractors.com/files/file/56-repower-instructions-of-900-7100-tractor/

 

Quick question guys! Does this adaptor plate have to stay in and if so how thick is it supposed to be, and why does it have to stay?

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rbstuartjr

From that post what I understand  is that plate is just a drill guide used for drilling the holes for the command engine. Once the holes are drilled, you remove the adapter plate.

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hurleyii
1 hour ago, rbstuartjr said:

From that post what I understand  is that plate is just a drill guide used for drilling the holes for the command engine. Once the holes are drilled, you remove the adapter plate.

That's what I thought to but it says to use a whole saw for the back 2 holes.

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hurleyii

thanks very much, not gonna lie there was some grinding and lots of it . 
 All I did was watch a few YouTube videos for beginners to help adjust things. I mean I did have to touch up a few spots amd for some reason I can’t get wire speed quite right from what I watched online it’s to fast but if I slow it down it spits and sputters.

a quality welder makes a difference to. This is a cheap Lincoln migpak 10. Last winter for a section I had to weld I used a crapsman from a friend it was horrific.  Someday I will buy my own welder and it will be much nicer

Edited by hurleyii
Say thanks

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GWGAllisfan
12 hours ago, hurleyii said:

Quick question guys! Does this adaptor plate have to stay in and if so how thick is it supposed to be, and why does it have to stay?

I couldn't find any information on how thick or even a drawing that had complete dimensions. I would love to get one of those or if we could find on that some one could measure for people to make them.

I think the reason for the holes saw is that the back holes in a command, when lined up in a 7100 frame are right in that sort of x shaped stamped area. I tried using a plywood pattern and missed the hole by enough the bolt won't fit. Still trying to get back to is, so don't know how I will solve yet.

I Think the hole saw was designed to either  let you use the plate, or maybe it came with a special washer in the kit or something?

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rbstuartjr
1 hour ago, hurleyii said:

thanks very much, not gonna lie there was some grinding and lots of it . 
 All I did was watch a few YouTube videos for beginners to help adjust things. I mean I did have to touch up a few spots amd for some reason I can’t get wire speed quite right from what I watched online it’s to fast but if I slow it down it spits and sputters.

a quality welder makes a difference to. This is a cheap Lincoln migpak 10. Last winter for a section I had to weld I used a crapsman from a friend it was horrific.  Someday I will buy my own welder and it will be much nicer

I have only a 110 volt Clarke weld set up for flux core. It does what I need for now. My buddy as a Miller tig welder . He paid like $5000 for it, so any of my big jobs I farm out to him. I still would like a nice one, some day.

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hurleyii
3 hours ago, rbstuartjr said:

I have only a 110 volt Clarke weld set up for flux core.

That’s what this Lincoln is except it’s capable of using gas as well.

if I where you I’d look at the Omni Volcon from H.F. It’s what I intend on buying. When I purchase. Compares to a 3,500. Miller in performance. My only curiosity would be on longevity and how well it would do on continuous duty. However for us Hobby guys it’s perfect.

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hurleyii

Well guys I had to help my dad this weekend so not much accomplished and I'm working for 3 days this week. 

So tonight I installed most of the tins back in place in the engine and discovered I'm missing the governor idle spring when trying to figure out where the governor spring went. If all goes well tomorrow night I'll finish that as I have to figure out where I put a coupe screws.  Then I'll set her in the engine bay. Well gotta be up early so ttyl guys.

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