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Allis Chalmers 716?


macallis180

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Checking on the possible purchase of an Allis Chalmers 716 from a member.  I'm new to these, so any info I might need before purchase would be appreciated.

Thanks.

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Basically the same as a Simplicity 7016 but with a Kohler engine vs a Briggs.

I personally prefer this “size” of Sovereign, a little smaller than the 7100 series. Only drawback is no hydraulic lift.  The electric lift option works fine for me. 
 

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Yes, I noticed the lack of hydraulic lift, as ad mentioned electric lift. Probably wouldn't be a problem for me either, as my HB's run my front plow and rear tiller. This would probably be a mower, vac, sweeper tractor for me if the owner calls me back.

Seller said his Dad got the tractor from a neighbor, My concern is the seller said he overhauled it for his Dad, cause it needed it, his Dad painted it while the engine was out, and said the deck was junk.  Said his Dad lost interest later, and decided to sell.

 May have had a hard life, so I've asked the owner lots of questions about it.

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On 9/2/2021 at 6:18 PM, macallis180 said:

Yes, I noticed the lack of hydraulic lift, as ad mentioned electric lift. Probably wouldn't be a problem for me either,

If it has an electric lift, that is a plus, since they originally were manual. The electric lifts work well and are reliable. They use the same rockshaft and lift mechanism as the hydraulic lifts. A little slower than hydraulic but more than acceptable performance.

I run a snowplow, blower and tiller, no problem on my 7016-6 and 710 with electric lifts

Edited by AC710
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  • 2 weeks later...

I have a 716H with an electric lift. I don't have experience with the the 7100 series hydraulic, but the electric has worked fine for my needs with a tiller.

Cool looking, tough little tractors. It tackled grass overgrown by a foot in my yard when I first moved in with out missing a beat.

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Well, I did go down to IA to get the 716.

I don't see any way to hook up the pulley on the mower deck belt to a PTO? Deck was not on when I picked it up. Owner said it had PTO on it for mower, but all I see is a cone clutch on the side?  What am I missing?

Thanks.

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4 hours ago, macallis180 said:

  What am I missing?

Maybe the RBT “hanging idler” setup. It’s a hanging unit with a “V” pulley and back side pulley the guides the belt down from the cone clutch to center deck pulley. Something like the FDT “hanging PTO” but without the clutch feature. 
No access to my pic “library” ATM or I’d post a pick of the assembly. 
 

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Thanks, guys.

I have contacted the gentleman I bought this from, and sent him a picture of what is missing on the tractor.  I had asked him if it had a PTO before I committed by message to purchase, and he said it did. (my first tractor like this, didn't know if PTO was just up inside frame, and not visible when I got there).  He said it must still be at his Dad's as the tractor did have the mower deck underneath it when his Dad purchased it.  I live over 200 miles away from him. so had to be only by text message until I got there.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Thanks, guys.

I have contacted the gentleman I bought this from, and sent him a picture of what is missing on the tractor.  I had asked him if it had a PTO before I committed by message to purchase, and he said it did. (my first tractor like this, didn't know if PTO was just up inside frame, and not visible when I got there).  He said it must still be at his Dad's as the tractor did have the mower deck underneath it when his Dad purchased it.  I live over 200 miles away from him. so had to be only by text message until I got there.

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Merle, if you are replacing pto I would go with 900 series.  Uses a longer belt for snowblower, but much better in that application.  Still uses same belt for mowing, but you need to move idler pulley to other hole in arm.  Send me pm, I should have what you need.

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On 9/21/2021 at 4:30 PM, macallis180 said:

Well, I did go down to IA to get the 716.

I don't see any way to hook up the pulley on the mower deck belt to a PTO? Deck was not on when I picked it up. Owner said it had PTO on it for mower, but all I see is a cone clutch on the side?  What am I missing?

Thanks.

Thee pulley is behind the cone clutch. There should be some pulleys underneath with a spring tension set up. 72" belt if memory serves.

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Yep, the pulley/spring  arrangement underneath is missing. The cone clutch is there, but froze up.

Thanks for responding.

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Guess I'll need help to free up the cone clutch.  Pulleys run all the time,  actuator lever just flops back and forth. Looked on UTube tonight for a Zippo Varga tutorial on cone clutch, but came up mt.

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@macallis180

Since you said you aren't familiar with RBT tractors, here's a few pics of their various parts. 

A pic of the left Simplicity 7100/AC 900 side plate to compare with the side plate of your tractor:  

IMG_4788.thumb.jpg.31c55ca51343a729d9136b2bac2ba54c.jpg

The plate with the slot in it is where the "adjusting" V pulley is mounted.  The only pulley mounted on the "swinging" arm is the back side idler pulley which is mounted on a tab; there are 2 tabs, one for the deck and one for the snowblower.  The difference between the tabs is the degree they are bent toward the centerline of the tractor (deck tab bent more sharply).  The hole in the bottom of the "swinging" arm is where the tension spring setup is hooked.  

A backside view with all parts and belt mounted for snowblower duty:

IMG_8369.thumb.jpg.b98750f4464907d66630dd077b1f5b36.jpg

A composite pic of the parts: 

6161e05f2c3ba_7100SeriesPTOParts1b.thumb.jpg.040f9a56fa6ec8968f3a4db388b5cbe3.jpg

Top right - "hanging" swing arm with backside idler pulley.

Bottom left - "adjusting" V pulley with mounting hardware.

Bottom right - tension parts without spring or mounting hardware.  I think this is the same setup as used on your tractor.  

 

15 hours ago, macallis180 said:

Guess I'll need help to free up the cone clutch.  Pulleys run all the time,  actuator lever just flops back and forth.

It might just need adjustment.  As can be seen in the video above, it doesn't move much axially. And you'll have to remove it to install a 7100/900 series side plate if you're switching to that style of RBT PTO.  Here's some prior posts about problems with the cone clutch:

https://simpletractors.com/forums/topic/63148-simplicty-7016-cone-clutch-service-question/

https://simpletractors.com/forums/topic/62963-my-sovereign-is-broke-pto-no-working/

https://simpletractors.com/forums/topic/64511-917-pto-slipping/

https://simpletractors.com/forums/topic/64518-deck-not-engaging/

Let us know what you find.  

 

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Thanks, guys. Finally done with working on and running our Pumpkinfest last weekend.  Hopefully I'll have some time next week for this new problem child!   LOL.

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Engine missing regulator/rectifier = my first Kohler, didn't realize this either when I picked it up.  More $$$$$. Don't know if stator works, as can't bear to run engine at high enough rpm in shed to see if it has a working stator!    lol.  Muffler falling apart. Fell apart in my hands as I was changing mounting as muffler was mounted crooked, and  burned light socket and wire .

Got cone clutch freed up.

Ron Erickson had the hanging PTO parts I needed, so went up to Menominee, WI yesterday to buy them, and see their fantastic collection of AC garden tractors.  AND 2 awesome pulling tractors!  AND 1 of 3 (known to exist)  post hole diggers on the back of a B series l&g tractor - beautiful.!

Now if I can get a muffler, maybe I can cut some grass yet this fall - but not charge the battery!     Lol.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Fortunately, Ken Holz had a used muffler which he sold to me, got it modified a bit and mounted. Neighbor helping me with the wiring indicated the stator was putting out at least 28 volts (after repairing more wiring). Bought an aftermarket rectifier for the Kohler 341, and mounted it. Still need to have neighbor help me with some more of the screwed up wiring before I put gas tank back in and start engine again and see if I have charging. Here's hoping.  Lol.

Edited by macallis180
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