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bccan

Help! Legacy 47” 2 Stage Auger Gearbox

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bccan

Pulled out of the garage this morning, engaged blower aaaaand, no blow. Found it works rather well as a snowplow, did the driveway with it, just pushing. Impeller is being driven normally while PTO engaged, the shaft into the auger gear box is spinning away and nothing being transferred to auger shafts.

Impeller is engaged to shaft, shaft engaged into auger gear box, all shear bolts that I know of are intact. Check me on this - cross bolt on keyed input shaft (to chain case @ driveshaft yoke), shear bolt and cross bolt in front of impeller, R-L auger shear bolts. The impeller shaft is spinning in the auger gear box. Did I miss any? If I did it might certainly save me some time, heartache and money! Unfortunately I don’t see it happening.

Started the post mortem, drained lube, removed vertical mount plate between gearbox and top of housing, disconnected auger shaft bearings & collars @ housing sides, removed cross & shear bolts from impeller shaft. How do I now remove the whole assembly? Is the impeller shaft 1 piece from chain case to auger gear box? Should I just take the gear box apart in place?

Would appreciate whatever input I can get on this situation.

1693762 47” 2 Stage “New Style” Chain Case (squarish, sealer around edges, plastic caplug on top)

Edited by bccan

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Ronald Hribar

I bought a used gearbox off ebay

i tried to buy replacement gears but none were right size

my 2 stage is on my Prestige

and is driven by a belt

but looks like the Legacys

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bccan

Thx for replies.  Gearbox is $1329.53 from Simplicity if it is actually even available, most sources have it as ‘no longer available.”

I guess my 2 main questions prior to autopsy regard getting the whole assembly out of the box.  I think the shaft runs all the way back into the chain case but not sure and don’t want to break it open if unnecessary.  The parts diagram leaves things hazy on that, at least to me.

Does the chain case have to come apart to remove the shaft?

Is the worm in the auger gear box part of the impeller shaft or keyed/pinned to it?

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bccan

Can I get opinions on this gear? At first sight I was absolutely sure it is my problem. included below is pic of a new, similar gear that injected a touch of doubt. I’m still fairly sure my gear is shot but before I go and order a gear & seals, I’d appreciate input from those that have been Inside auger gears before.
 

Worm gear on shaft looks nice, bearings good, etc

6D6CEE35-18DF-49B1-A789-8E66DF770E8D.jpeg

5807ACD9-BD28-471D-8A71-D070283A61F6.jpeg

22BF0FF1-EF60-4F9B-A8E1-59672B896C89.jpeg

D3524C86-263A-4F4E-B200-09736B637895.png

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Ronald Hribar

On my gearbox that gear had a spot where all the teeth were sheared off

both the steel gear and the brass gear have keys in them

there are bronze bushings on the ends of both shafts

on my blower there was a connection between the auger gearbox and the blower

i had broken the cast connection previously 

and was forced at that time to weld it solid

when I had to replace gears 

I cut the weld 

and after repairs I put on a shaft coupler

I do not think the new gear you have pictured is the right size

I have two new gears in my junk collection that I ordered and were wrong size

they were for simplicity blowers

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bccan

 

Junk that’s visible in previous pics is mostly little paint and or sealer flakes from separating the box. There is the slightest glint to the drained grease but it takes a bright light to even catch it, microscopic in size. No grit to the lube and can’t slough anything off the cast surfaces inside case.

Got it apart. Yes, the chain case has to be opened up. Upper gear/shaft just pulls out of the bearing by hand. Pounded the lower (impeller) shaft through from back to front with a brass drift to separate the gear and drive it through the impeller and out the front of the snow box, took quite a few “medium” hits. Yes, the worm gear is pinned to the impeller shaft with a solid steel pin and looks like new. Bearings and races all good. Impeller fan rides on a thin bushing, shaft bumps through with a few moderate taps. Bronze gear looked to be intact and quite serviceable.

 

 
8c012a3b-a560-489a-bf2e-13286a20ebe4-jpe

 

98BFAE75-8AFC-4521-A3DD-FE8834A38C2E.jpeg

Edited by bccan
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bccan

90319B86-4B69-49F0-B10B-120C2304C152.jpeg

051A099B-17B4-4BE9-AE29-3C70E2186B23.jpeg

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396F8923-4522-4C3F-89C1-8A7047446D3E.jpeg

738939A7-D3C0-43CC-86D9-ACE004C9C603.jpeg
 

At this point I still couldn’t find the cause of death. So, off to the auger shaft I went. Bearings looked good, gear seemed tight. Scruffy wheeled a little rust off the shaft ends, had to grind & polish around the shear pin holes as there was a couple thousandths of deformation around the holes, after that the bearings slid nicely off the shaft. Stood the shaft on end, put a 1” open end wrench (to bridge the shaft) against the bronze gear, gave it a few taps and what with my wondering eyes did I see? A sheared square key with a touch of evidence of ”spin.”



So, off to the auto parts store tomorrow for a key and hopefully the 3 seals for the shafts. Certainly a disproportionate amount of work for a $2 key but the wallet is getting off the hook easy!

38E3BD23-853D-40A7-8D5B-44549B6729E3.jpeg

D1A02A13-5E63-4A1D-8BA9-0D15C51DABF1.jpeg

Edited by bccan
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bccan

Ronald - Thx for reply, I noticed after my above storybook.  That was my thought (and hope) going into this.  I’ve never been into a job like this so I didn’t know what to expect.  Seemed strange to have a well maintained implement of solid substance just crap out like it did, especially when it appeared to work fine when put away last spring and when installed a few weeks ago.  Hopefully I have happy hunting tomorrow for parts.

Upside is I gained some knowledge and I know the condition and service status of these assemblies.

Edited by bccan
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PhanDad

Is the sheared key bronze or another soft material?  

I'd be surprised if it's steel and there's no damage to the bronze gear keyway.  

 

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bccan

I think you’re right, hadn’t thought it through!  I guess I’ll play with that when reassembling. I did stamp it for orientation so at least I know how it came apart.

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bruker1

The reason I mentioned it was several years ago I had to replace the bearings and seals on a rototiller that had a similar worm and worm gear set up. The brass worm gear was showing considerable wear but just on the side of the teeth that was contacting the worm. I flipped the gear around and it's been running great ever since.

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bccan

PhanDad - Sorry for missing your question.  Key is steel.

Bruker1 - I’m traveling but intend to investigate flipping the gear before I install new seals when assembling.  I’ll report back.

Having never messed with this type of assembly before, I split the box before I got everything removed.  Looking at the gear I thought it was all worn out, right up until seeing a photo of a similar, new  gear while searching for replacement.  Once I got everything completely apart, the existing gear does not seem to show much wear, certainly nothing I would consider unusual.  I’ll pay more attention when I get eyes and hands back on it.

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bccan

Got back into town, finished cleaning up parts, packed bearings and reassembled. With bronze gear cleaned up, it really didn’t show wear so I installed it in same orientation. I used seals from the auto parts store, crossed against B & S #’s and also by dimensions. I ended up with a full length of key stock so I have enough for about 15 more failures! Went back together more easily than it came apart, but that’s a combo of newfound familiarity, burnished shafts and clean parts. Happily while cleaning up the chain case I found the broken master link clip in the grease and replaced it. Don’t know if it had been like that and it didn’t let go or if I somehow broke it.  

For lack of much info on the subject and extinction of “Simplicity Cold Weather Worm Gear Oil,” I filled gear box & chain case w/ 00 grease, anyone have concerns about that?

Started Her up, engaged blower, all seems in order. Now it just has to work in snow.

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Bill725
1 hour ago, bccan said:

“Simplicity Cold Weather Worm Gear Oil,”

Operators Manual states "OIL" not grease. A "worm gear oil" search shows a pour bottle, i.e. Royal Purple Thermyl-Glyde Worm Gear Oil.

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bccan

Bill - duly noted on lube.  I can’t find either of Purple Nurple’s worm gear lubes in less than 5 gal pail.  I did a lot of looking into the lubes and found everything from the Simplicity worm gear oil, Roticul oil, steam cylinder oil, whale oil, gear oil, various mfg specific oils & greases, but most suggestions seemed to default to 00 grease when in doubt.  It’s liquid, a little thicker than gear oil, but flowable, comes in a squirt bottle, seems like it will give the worm lube & protection while still flowing into the bearings.

Last year I put an ounce or two of gear oil in the auger box to top it up.  It leaked out, very slowly, over the off season.  I don’t remember if it was from the case seam or one of the shaft seals but I decided gear oil wasn’t the right stuff.  When I reassembled the case I did put a film of rtv as a precaution.

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