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GregB

Slow starter, not me, the B-110

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GregB

Working on the B110 loader tractor.  Starter spins way slow, barely moves.

It has the constant load of the loader pump on it also.

 

I know the clean all connections, jump to starter etc.

But the positive cable to the push switch uses a clamp style battery terminal.

I want to replace the terminal and cable,

but what gauge was the original wire?

 

If I am going to do this I want to go next size larger.

Edited by GregB

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Bill725

If you are not using a 51R-500CCA battery it will help. I have one in my 2012 FEL tractor and do not have a problem starting. Replaced my cables with automotive cables.

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PhanDad
3 hours ago, GregB said:

what gauge was the original wire?

You can use this table to determine wire gauge:

Breaking Force for Copper Wire

This estimate is based on nick-free soft annealed Cu wire having a tensile strength of 37000 pounds per square inch.

AWG gauge Conductor
Diameter Inches
Conductor
Diameter mm
Conductor cross section in mm2 Ohms per 1000 ft. Ohms per km Maximum amps for chassis wiring Maximum amps for
power transmission
Maximum frequency for
100% skin depth for solid conductor copper
Breaking force Soft Annealed Cu 37000 PSI
0000 0.46 11.684 107 0.049 0.16072 380 302 125 Hz 6120 lbs
000 0.4096 10.40384 84.9 0.0618 0.202704 328 239 160 Hz 4860 lbs
00 0.3648 9.26592 67.4 0.0779 0.255512 283 190 200 Hz 3860 lbs
0 0.3249 8.25246 53.5 0.0983 0.322424 245 150 250 Hz 3060 lbs
1 0.2893 7.34822 42.4 0.1239 0.406392 211 119 325 Hz 2430 lbs
2 0.2576 6.54304 33.6 0.1563 0.512664 181 94 410 Hz 1930 lbs
3 0.2294 5.82676 26.7 0.197 0.64616 158 75 500 Hz 1530 lbs
4 0.2043 5.18922 21.1 0.2485 0.81508 135 60 650 Hz 1210 lbs
5 0.1819 4.62026 16.8 0.3133 1.027624 118 47 810 Hz 960 lbs
6 0.162 4.1148 13.3 0.3951 1.295928 101 37 1100 Hz 760 lbs
7 0.1443 3.66522 10.6 0.4982 1.634096 89 30 1300 Hz 605 lbs
8 0.1285 3.2639 8.37 0.6282 2.060496 73 24 1650 Hz 480 lbs
9 0.1144 2.90576 6.63 0.7921 2.598088 64 19 2050 Hz 380 lbs
10 0.1019 2.58826 5.26 0.9989 3.276392 55 15 2600 Hz 314 lbs
11 0.0907 2.30378 4.17 1.26 4.1328 47 12 3200 Hz 249 lbs
12 0.0808 2.05232 3.31 1.588 5.20864 41 9.3 4150 Hz 197 lbs
13 0.072 1.8288 2.63 2.003 6.56984 35 7.4 5300 Hz 150 lbs
14 0.0641 1.62814 2.08 2.525 8.282 32 5.9 6700 Hz

119 lbs

Above chart from:

https://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm

 

 

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GregB

The battery cables on mine are 4 gauge, is that original?

The ends on the long one do not look like a factory crimp.

 

Edited by GregB

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Bill725
20 hours ago, GregB said:

Is your starting circuit using a solenoid, or push button start like mine?

2012 have push button start. 

Edited by Bill725

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PhanDad
9 hours ago, GregB said:

The battery cables on mine are 4 gauge, is that original?

The ends on the long one do not look like a factory crimp.

 

Didn't measure the gauge, but I believe my B-110 cables are originals:

IMG_2092.thumb.JPG.abeb900282d712072bb145290213a79c.JPG

Voltage_Regulator_0001.jpg.4ef0f20e6c7129ca28590883be3a4a3e.jpg

 

S/G cable end:

IMG_1022.thumb.JPG.f1e1594101b0e02c5ba6433932937895.JPG

 

To S/G side of push button switch:

IMG_1024.thumb.JPG.598bc74efb29ef6cae12438dd89d6a36.JPG

 

From battery side of push button switch:

IMG_1025.thumb.JPG.7a877a9b272a840ab98207055a794c2c.JPG

 

PS - I can measure the cable diameter tomorrow if you want.

 

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GregB

Thanks for the pics.  S/G end looks like mine.

I bought new ends that I am going to crimp then solder.  Shrink tube over that.

New battery terminals also.

 

When I applied 12v right to the starter, spun pretty good.

 

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PhanDad
2 hours ago, GregB said:

When I applied 12v right to the starter, spun pretty good.

Although it could be corrosion of the connector, I'd be suspicious of the push button switch contacts.  

As part of your "upgrades" I'd spray the switch with CRC 2-26 and "exercise" the switch while you have the S/G or battery disconnected.  

A check of the voltage at the S/G terminal while under starting load will tell if there's still too much resistance in the wiring.  

 

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MrSteele

I know that you said "crimp, then solder". Too many folks working on electrical systems these days, crimp only. Soldering is apparently a lost art? If someone has worked on your machine before you, and that is highly likely with these old toys, somewhere wires were replaced with crimped ends. There are those who will say that crimping is fine, and works perfectly for them. I solder everything, then shrink wrap the connection. Looking for corrosion? Only have to look at the ends, because all connections in between were soldered properly, solder penetrating the wires attaching the ends, then crimped, then reheated for good measure. Takes longer, but I don't look back at connections. But, I am the guy that uses welding stinger wire for jumper cables, with the wire soldered to the clamps!

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