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surviver2003

Homelite T16S center pto

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surviver2003
Hello, Been lurking, just about every day and sometimes twice a day, and learning on this site since I bought the T16S last May. The tractor came with a 42 inch plow and I've purchased a rototiller for it a couple months ago. My questions are: Can I add a center pto to the tractor (otherwise the tiller will be useless to me)? Are the parts available and if so where can I find them? I have many questions and really need your help and expertise. Have included phots in my gallery in addition to this photo(hope this worked).:) Sorry, don't know how to add photo from gallery.:I, but the photos are in my gallery and you will note that there is a shaft out of the left side of the bgb where a pto would go, but where do I go from here? [img]http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/uploaded/bob_king/P1010012.jpg[/img]

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SmilinSam
Theoretically one could add a cone clutch PTO if one could figure a way to engage and disengage it. Its a project on my "extended" list of things to do. You know, that list that is at least 6-12 months away all the time. The original tillers were engaged in the same manner as the 36" tillers for the B 210/212, 300/400 series Ac's, 3200 and 3300 series Simplicitys. The tillers had a engagement mechanism on the tiller itself and belt stops around the pulley that fits on the shaft sticking out the bevel gear box. Sam

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gjh
Welcome aboard Bob. You've come to the right place for Homelite info. I picked up a T12H two years ago & knew nothing about tractors. With the help from many people on the site like Sam & Dutch I've gotten through many repairs/upgrades. If anyone knows these machines it's Sam!

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surviver2003
Sam, Gary, Thanks for your replies. It seems from the literature for the homelites that the center pto was an option. Therefore, it would seem that a center pto could be purchased as a kit or one from a parts tractor (homelite or comparable simplicity) could be obtained. I cannot find any reference to a center pto kit for the homelite T16 or comparable simplicity. If there is a kit could someone get me pointed in the right direction to find it. If the parts can be obtained off a parts tractor, where might I find installation instructions. Any ideas?

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BLT
If the shaft is threaded on the end you could probably fit in a cone clutch. If just keyed it only held on pulleys and the clutching was done by the implement. Judging by the frame, you would have a Lanlord Soverign type tractor and maybe aan late 60' or an early 70's. The first two digits of engine serial number would help. That should be on the blower housing RH side lower. Then on the opening page of the web site in x Reference you could find a like type Simplictity parts book or books to guide you. This web site has an ocean full of information avaialble.

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SmilinSam
BoB, I have never seen myself where there was a center PTO available for the Allis built Homelites like you have pictured above. What sort of literature do you have? All of the AC implements that I am aware of drove off the rear or the front. The Simplicity Homelites came standard with the center PTO, so it would not have been sold as a add on kit.

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surviver2003
This is the quote from the specifications for the T16H from this site. The specs for the T16S only mentions the front electric clutch. I think both tractors take the same tiller, but how? Wouldn't the belt tightener clutch for the T16H also fit the T16S? T16H "POWER TAKE-OFF At front of engine through electric clutch or from left hand side of bevel gear box through belt tightener clutch."

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BLT
quote:
Originally posted by SmilinSam
Ok I understand. The belt tightener clutch they are talking of is on the tiller. Not on the tractor.
Sam that was my thoughts if I'm the right Bob:o)

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surviver2003
Sam, Bob, Not sure how to create a link, but if you go to "Simple trACtors" part of this site and click on "Homelite" on left hand side, then click on "Allis-Made Specs", then click on "T-16S" and under TRACTOR it describes the Power Take-off. Also note that on the "Homelite page the photo of the "Homelite T-16 made by Simplicity" there is a lever approximately where the driver's left calf would be. This engages the clutch for the center pto. I'm sure the T-16S is set-up the same way but can't find a photo. I'll get a photo of the tiller and post as soon as I can. The Homelite T-16S #1600321 is equivalent to the Simplicity 3416S #990872 and the roto-tiller 36" is #1690039. I really appreciate your patience. I'm really a relative novice at working on a garden tractor (although I've always done minor car repairs such as brakes, water pump, starter/generater replacement etc. and even rebuilt the motor on an Opel in the 60's). Still have not got the hang of attaching photos or creating a link, but learning fast.

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SmilinSam
The PTO units from the simplicity built T-16 will not interchange with the AC built T-16(which is what you have pictured at the top of this post)The AC units are entirely a different tractor than the Simplicity units. The Simplicity never made a T-16S for Homelite that I'm aware of( of course I could be wrong) Are we on the same page yet? I'll keep trying if not.

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BLT
Bob King go here and type in the Simplicity numbers you posted. Both operators and parts manuals are there. This should help you out. My gut feeling is you have a shaft only to put on pulley and the PTO was engaged on the implement. http://www.simplicitytechpubs.com/techpubsearch.php#start

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plowman

Bob king, On my t-16 the shaft on the rear end just has a pulley on it, I don't know anything about a center pto, In the picture you can see a U-shaped handle sticking up , This handle moves the small pulley to put tension on the belt to drive the tiller. Hope this helps. Chris

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Terry9
Hi Bob, this is what you should have for a rear PTO. I have the same tiller as plowman pictured above. This pulley measures 4.750 in diameter. As stated above, the tiller has the mechanism with which to engage/disengage the belt.

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surviver2003
Terry, Plowman, Bob T., Sam By golly you guys are right. My tiller is white instead of blue but has the belt tightner as you demonstrated. All the literature search in the world just wasn't going to be of any help to me. I'll take pictures of it tomorrow and post here. Still have a couple questions: When you look up the tiller mfg. no. 1690039, the instructions show it being connected to a clutch center pto? The cross reference tables indicate the T16-S as being essentially the same as the Simplicity 3415S and The 3416S. How similar are they? Where do I get a pully for the bgb shaft? Do you have an operators or parts manuals for the T16 Homelite. Willing to pay whatever is reasonable for a copy. Again, thanks guys==== Bob K.

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BLT
quote:
Originally posted by bob_king
Have put photos of my tiller mfg. no. 1690039 in my gallery photos. There is also a photo of the pully that came with it. Does anyone have a diagram of how t hook this up to a T16S?
Bob I have found what best describes what you need. At the Simplicity site download 990694. After looking at all the pictures of the Homelite tiller and this manual this is as close as you are going to get.. The power engagement is done off the tiller. All of the pulleys for a 1690039 as you show are used for the cone clutch center pulley used on later models and all belt tensioning is constant.. From what I can see is that you need a BGB with a cone clutch arrangement or get the parts to convert your exsisting tiller to conform to the manual 990694.

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Dutch
Bob,
quote:
Originally posted by bob_king [brThe cross reference tables indicate the T16-S as being essentially the same as the Simplicity 3415S and The 3416S. How similar are they?
Your T-16 is Allis built NOT Simplicity built.
quote:
Originally posted by bob_king
Where do I get a pully for the bgb shaft?
If you just want to get the tiller working, the pulley doesn't have to be OEM Homelite. Just get a 4.5"-5" pulley that will fit the BGB shaft, with the proper width for the belt. Such pullys are available from McMaster, Grainger, etc. You can engage / disengage the tiller by using the over-center clutch on the tiller.

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thedaddycat
The older tillers had the engagement clutch mounted on the tractor, not the tiller. The rear PTO was driven by the smaller outboard pulley while the center PTO was driven from the larger inboard pulley, both of which were keyed to the left side of the BGB output shaft. Here's a pic of the older style tiller and clutch. I have used the old tiller on my 3310 without any modification or problems. I do not know if this type rear PTO clutch was used for the vacuum system or not. I think the cone clutch for center/rear PTOs was used on the 3400/7000/7100 tractors(post 1971 models).

Here's a newer one, similar to the one shown above.

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BLT
Bob read thru 990694 manual. It states that it can be operated via the center PTO (cone clucth)or its own release mechanism on the tiller. As I said before that is as close as I can get you

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