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Kokomo

Electric vs. Hdro Lift / Johnny Jr. Bucket

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Kokomo
I need advice on an electric lift conversion kit for a 7100 series tractor. I am going to purchase a Johnny Jr. lift and want a Simplicity 7000 Series or possibility some other Simplicity to put the lift on. I have found a 7114 with electric lift and a 7117 without electric lift. I like the 7117 better because of the twin engine. 1) Will an electric lift work well on this kind of application or should I use hydraulic lift system? 2) Is it practical to modify the 7117 with a hydraulic lift system running of f the PTO? I have the price for an electric lift kit from a 1992 Simplicity catalog, part number,1690392; retailing for just over $400.00. Does any one know the current retail price for the kit?

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Dutch
quote:
Originally posted by Kokomo
Will an electric lift work well on this kind of application or should I use hydraulic lift system?
If I were going to use an electric lift for a Johnny Bucket, I think I'd also use the gear reduction kit offered for use with the 38" tillers.

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Les
I have both an electric and hydraulic lift, I do not have a Johnny Bucket. On the 7100 series tractors, the hydraulic lift is attached to the hydrostatic trans. On the older "B" series the hydraulic lift mounted between the engine and the bevel box. I do not know if an older lift can be retrofitted to a 7100 series but I have never heard of it. To the best of my knowlege, the electric lift is no longer available new. I would believe that either lift would work fine on the johhnny bucket, altough I have heard of electric lift units burning out and needing to be rebuilt. The actual power unit is a linear actuator, like what they use for automatic gate openers. Once you have used a hydro lift, the electric will seem very very slow. Your best option would be to get a tractor with a hydraulic lift. Retrofitting one is possible, probably easy IF the recieving tractor has the mounting point for the hand lever. As far as the bigger engine being better, my experience(with dirt work) is that you will run out of traction first and the extra hp will be redundant. PTO work is another story. Good Luck!

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thedaddycat
I have the electric lift on the 3310 and a JBJr. and I can tell you that under full load the electric lift will strain, especially if you don't have the rear counter-balanced counterweight. I would go with the hydraulic lift. Here's a pic of the rig I use with mine. I had to strike a balance between too little(hard to lift full bucket) and too much(hard to lower empty bucket) counterweight. I made an extension for the factory counterweight and used first one and then two collar weights trying to find the right balance.

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Kokomo
Thanks for the advice; I am new to this tractor collecting. In 1998 my wife and I decided to downsize, sold the house, cub cadet and about everything else but my tools(had to pay to store them). That lasted six months, bought a smaller house(hard for the kids to move back in) and a hand mower(1/2 acres); that lasted one season. In May of 1999 I took a day off work and went shopping for a tractor, somehow I bought a Simplicity Landlord DLX and snowplow. The next year not wanting to change the plow and mower deck, I purchased a used 1999 Broadmoor with a 38” deck and like to mow with it better than the Landlord. Two weeks ago last Saturday my son talked me into going to a large group farm auction held twice a year and I bought a Simplicity 5212 with out a mower deck than would hardly run. Had no ideal why I bought it and still don’t. I clean the carb did a tune-up and the thing runs fine. Last Monday wanting to do some yard work with a tiller and not wanting to walk, I bought 6211 with a tiller and deck that would not run, did a tune-up, bought a new carb and freed the brass bushing that holds the double pulley on the shuttle system. Looks almost new and tills very will(no electric lift). Have been thinking about how I could use my snowplow to pick up dirt and last Thursday found the Johnny Jr. Bucket on the net and I was hooked. Spent all day Friday, Saturday and Sunday looking for a tractor with the wife(she is very understanding). I purchased a 7117 Hydo (no power lift) because it had been serviced every year, ran well and saw that Johnny Jr. came out with a loader, with its own electric lift. LES YOU ARE RIGHT ABOUT THIS BEING ADDICTIVE. I figure out if got rid of my two older cars(79 Elcamino & 86 Camero) I could store 12 tractors. Now back to business; I would like advice, input, info or any feelings on the following. 1) Did I make a mistake going without hydraulic lift? I suppose I can still try to install hydraulics and buy the Johnny lift without the electric system. 2) The Universal Johnny lift, with its own electric attaches to the hitch at the rear of the tractor. I hope I can put a roto tiller on the rear of the tractor also. The Simplicity Dealer in Ft. Wayne, IN said he felt he could still get an electric conversion lift kit for the 7100 series tractor. There are two garden tractor auctions in Indiana in the next thirty days, if I knew what type of tractor buy, I assume I could convert this tractor to hydraulic or electric lift. 3) Would anyone have any hesitation about buying the Universal Johnny bucket with its own electric lift, before it has been in the field for a while? 4) I would drive a 100 miles or so, to see any ones tractor with a Johnny Jr. lift, if someone would be willing to show it to me. Thank very much for the advice, Bob in Kokomo. P.S. Yes the largest bull in the world is preserved in Highland park, Big Ben is his name and he is close to one hundred years old.

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thedaddycat
I forgot to mention that I now have a Johnny Box for my counterweight. It seems to work well, but the ground was frozen when I had it mounted last, so I'll have to test the scarrifiers out later this spring.....

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Kokomo
Les, thank you for the information on the electric/Hydraulic lifts. You mentioned the “B” series Hydraulics is mounted between the engine and the bevel box. I like this idea if it would work: would not have to change the Hydro trans. to run a hydraulic system on my 7117. It is my understanding that the Hydro tractors with Hydraulic systems have a larger pump. I assume by “B” series you mean any tractor that starts with a B. Were any of these tractors sold with a different designation? Does any one know if the parts are availble to repair an electric lift on a 7100 series? I know were there is a 7114 with an electric lift, but it does not work.

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thedaddycat
Check this post out. I don't know if they are still available but it's worth a shot........ http://www.simpletractors.com/club2/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11596&SearchTerms=Electro,Mojo

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Les
B series were Allis-Chalmers models made from 1961 through 1971. B-1, B-12, B-12, B-110, B-212 etc. Simplicity eq would be Sovereign Landlord etc. Kent has accumulated a "TON" of old product literature which is on the main site under Simplicity and Allis-Chalmers. I just cant ever say enough about how much time and energy Kent has put into this site. Kent, you are underappreciated for sure!

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dieselman
I dont think a pump off a B series would work because there is no room to mout it. the tank and batery are in the way. also i dont think ou will have to change your hydro. My dealer said all 7000 and 7100 series hydros were the same.

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thedaddycat
I have to second that. There is no room on the 3310 to mount the older hydraulic lift pump/tank/valve assembly which is why they went to the electric lift, I believe. I'm not sure which tractor was the last to be able to mount it. I know the 2012 could, as could the 2210 I got mine from.......

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UCD
As I understand it The differance in the hydro units with hydraulic lift and with out is in the relief valves. This has been discussed before. If I remember right Dutch and PatRarick both posted info on this subject. Someting like this that was just on ebay could be made to work to. It is a 12v hydraulic system. [url]http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=20544&item=2317469573&rd=1[/url] [img]http://ebay3.ipixmedia.com/abc/M28/_EBAY_95954117ef9f19d8e0c214c0270adc0b/i-1_B.JPG[/img]

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